A Gift From Facebook atmo -

[e-RICHIE]

Someone linked this gem on my wall -

The Death Of Expertise

...and I thought it was great, and apropos atmo. The read is fast, and I'd do myself a disservice by picking out a favorite thought, but here's one that resonates:

There’s also that immutable problem known as “human nature.” It has a name now: it’s called the Dunning-Kruger effect, which says, in sum, that the dumber you are, the more confident you are that you’re not actually dumb. And when you get invested in being aggressively dumb…well, the last thing you want to encounter are experts who disagree with you, and so you dismiss them in order to maintain your unreasonably high opinion of yourself. (There’s a lot of that loose on social media, especially.)

This, being the frame board where folks often ask "Why?" a lot, and then it's followed by a range of replies, some even being rooted in re-asking questions until the desired answer appears - the article seemed like it belongs here in plain view.

[Mike Mcdermid]

Someone linked this gem on my wall -

The Death Of Expertise

...and I thought it was great, and apropos atmo. The read is fast, and I'd do myself a disservice by picking out a favorite thought, but here's one that resonates:

This, being the frame board where folks often ask "Why?" a lot, and then it's followed by a range of replies, some even being rooted in re-asking questions until the desired answer appears - the article seemed like it belongs here in plain view.

I nearly said it was a bit complicated for my reading and understanding ..i nearly said i feel dumb but saying that would be equally as dumb, ..........now see i actually feel dumb for pointing out

[Wan Gerin]

"When we are in the grasp of illusion – or, for that matter, whenever we have a new idea – instead of searching for ways to prove our ideas wrong, we usually attempt to prove them correct. Psychologists call this the confirmation bias, and it presents a major impediment of our ability to break free from the misinterpretation of randomness.”

The Drunkards Walk by Leonard Mlodinow

His overarching point through the book is how randomness is often undetected and taken as fact. In this instance, trying the same thing over enough times may possibly lead to a positive result through random effect. But trying new things and going against one's theory can be the quickest route to the solution. In some circumstances it is the only route to the correct solution.

(The book gets mathematical and boring at times, but overall it's an interesting read.)

[Brian Smith]

Thanks for that article, I enjoyed it, and I agree that it is apropos.
I think that the removal of barriers to entry in the (online) conversation about this stuff was not without some unfortunate consequences for the quality of the discourse.

[JimFrain]

One of my favorite things about being a bike mechanic for many years (besides the lasting and genuine friendships that I appreciate the most) was how I had been hired for my first shop job.
I had no shop experience but had performed volunteer/mechanic work at a bike recycling non profit for a while before I walked into my first shop. When I applied for the mechanic position they asked me to go into the back and build a new bike (a Raleigh C-40 of which I have built at least hundreds now). The store manager came back and looked at it once I had finished, and hired me. I thought "what a great profession, where I can establish my qualifications through the quality of work that I do."

Now when I think back to that time I understand that it was his expertise that could discern the difference and establish my qualifications.

[EricKeller]

given the venue for the article in the OP, I'm guessing that it's not hard to demonstrate that the author is a sufferer from the Dunning-Kruger effect, albeit at a fairly high level. We all are to some degree, but that website is exhibit A in how you can sound reasonable while promoting unreasonable principles. Some people consider a Ph.D. to be a virtual license to expound at length on subjects that you know nothing about.

As I get older, the less I want to offer opinions outside of my area of demonstrated expertise. That's not to say I'm not constantly trying to expand that.

[e-RICHIE]

Well to bring it back to the frameforum, and to repeat what I wrote elsewhere,
and maybe even turn this into a conversation rather than a posting version of
Dueling Banjos, I'll just repeat myself.

This is not about age, or generation, or what station you were born into. You are either willing to learn and listen, or you're not. I read the text and think those who think they "know", but really don't, come from all walks of life.

As far as recoiling goes, I don't know if I can walk all the way away. I prefer to leave a window cracked and let folks know 1) what I want them to know or, 2) what they need to know. It also gives me an opportunity to figure my own stuff out. And, if I can affect one cat, even if I alienate ninety nine others, that would be okay with me.

I'm still gonna hit hard and take my licks when hit atmo.

[steve garro]

The Drunkards Walk by Leonard Mlodinow

His overarching point through the book is how randomness is often undetected and taken as fact. In this instance, trying the same thing over enough times may possibly lead to a positive result through random effect. But trying new things and going against one's theory can be the quickest route to the solution. In some circumstances it is the only route to the correct solution.

(The book gets mathematical and boring at times, but overall it's an interesting read.)

I am going to look into that, I have been studying the human thought bias process (there are over 300) as well as The illusion of Knowledge and ways we trick our brains daily into "reality"
(you have lots of spare time as a para)
- Garro.

[progetto]

I'm an expert on everything, I get all my knowledge from the internet.

[Andrew R Stewart]

"As far as recoiling goes, I don't know if I can walk all the way away. I prefer to leave a window cracked and let folks know 1) what I want them to know or, 2) what they need to know. It also gives me an opportunity to figure my own stuff out. And, if I can affect one cat, even if I alienate ninety nine others, that would be okay with me.

I'm still gonna hit hard and take my licks when hit atmo." From post #7


I fully embrace this. just the other day, in another bike forum, I was called a "straight up dick". After over 2K posts there i've been flamed a mere handful of times. I guess that's a good rate. But even if i was flamed far more often my opinions and advise is still valid.

Having said that i do know that i learn more by listening. Andy.

[Rody]

I was called a "straight up dick".

That's not a bad thing Andy, rather be that than accused of being a flaccid, uncommited one.


To all,

Moral of the story...no matter how long you are at something, true achievers are ones that understand there is always more to learn and do not stand upon a pedestal looking down on others.

Entitlement sucks, don't be one of those guys.

rody

[Eric Estlund]

Somehow Rody makes an erection joke and still comes off as being a class act. That, friends, is expertise.

[Craddock]

I read and I generally keep quiet, but I'd like contribute to the conversation what I think is my most valuable tool; my R&D loop.

Derivation, inspiration, calculation, fabrication, validation, iteration

It may seem banal to some, but it's the work I do to gain knowledge and experience. Derivation (or learning) comes first as we are all standing on the shoulders of giants.