We have officially become inured to mass shootings.

[jclay]

How do other countries do it?

I don't know about others but if I wanted to learn how to build bicycle frames I'd find out how successful framebuilders do it and then do what they do. Oh, shit, that's what I did...except for a couple of early crap frames where I didn't listen and follow. Hmmm. Is there a correlation?? I wonder.

The front end of my CX bike feels like it wants to wash out in the turns, and in other situations it feels too sensitive to steering inputs. Geometric trail is 52mm. How do I resolve this? Hmmmm.

I could argue that the frame is too stiff (yet compliant, of course), or the brakes, or the saddle, or it needs to be lighter or whatever. Maybe it's the lack of thru axle drops or cantis. But this just occurred to me! Lotsa folks make CX bikes and it's easy to find the dims of many successful builders! Gee, I wonder what that might reveal?

So, I took a look. The dims of my frame are in the range of a half dozen successful CX bikes that I just looked at....but the geometric trail of the fork is 10 to 15 mm less than rigs from established and successful builders (link here: https://www.velocipedesalon.com/foru...tml#post969706 ).

Rather than argue that what I did or what I thought was better than what others are doing, I'm gonna build a replacement fork to provide, pending discussion with others, 62ish mm geometric trail!

I'll bet you that the bike works better than it does with the current fork.

See, I didn't have to go and make all the mistakes myself. Besides, as my papa san was fond of saying "Learn from others. You won't have time to make all the mistakes yourself". That goes for our country, too. All we have to do is 1) look at the existing answer sheet and, 2) start changing the cultural/legal conversation to generate the necessary support, just as the NRA has been doing since the '70s, and we're on our way. It will take a while, of course.

Simple, if not easy. Or we can keep doing what we're doing.

[ides1056]

I am on the planning board in the small town where I live, and when we write new bylaws we find what other towns like us have done, and use that as a blueprint. It makes the process much easier to work with legislation that has already been written and refined and passed muster with the Attorney General.

Easy peasy. No need to reinvent the wheel.

[ides1056]

What leadership looks like.

Walmart to Limit Ammunition Sales After Mass Shooting at El Paso Store - The New York Times

"It’s clear to us that the status quo is unacceptable," said a spokesman.

[guido]

What leadership looks like.

Walmart to Limit Ammunition Sales After Mass Shooting at El Paso Store - The New York Times

"It’s clear to us that the status quo is unacceptable," said a spokesman.

Leadership would have banned all firearm and ammo sales the day of the event (if not years earlier...). Limiting restrictions to some classes of ammo after current stock had sold out is barely responding to public pressure. Be interesting to see how long the restrictions last after the spotlight moves on...

[jclay]

I am on the planning board in the small town where I live, and when we write new bylaws we find what other towns like us have done, and use that as a blueprint. It makes the process much easier to work with legislation that has already been written and refined and passed muster with the Attorney General.

Easy peasy. No need to reinvent the wheel.

The problem is when children, oops, I mean adults, don't like the answers.
Patchwork quilts of fractional/no measures will never work and "queer the pitch" for even talking about adequate measures; 'cause children and adults don't like the answers they don't like.

[mzilliox]

How do other countries do it? I believe they don't allow civilians to possess semi autos of combat calibre/power and they heavily regulate other firearms.

They didn't spend time dicking around with magazine size or other technical details. They wisely prevented weapons that can rapidly spit out bullets from being in the general population. And they regulate the hell out of the rest. Do they get all of them? Of course not. But do they get enough that their rates of mass shootings are a couple orders of magnitude less than ours. I shouldn't even have to pose the rhetorical question but some of the previous comments force me to do so.

We, unwisely, opened the flood gates so remediation will take a long time and lots of sticks, carrots and conversation/cultural changes. We are a stupid lot about too many things.

I don't know about others but if I wanted to learn how to build bicycle frames I'd find out how successful framebuilders do it and then do what they do. Oh, shit, that's what I did...except for a couple of early crap frames where I didn't listen and follow. Hmmm. Is there a correlation?? I wonder.

If I wanted to build a NASCAR team I'd find out how successful teams do it, and to avoid mistakes, how unsuccessful teams do it. If I was chronically in the loser's bracket, which we are in the firearms violence arena, I don't think I'd be arguing that my clever methods worked better than the methods that the winning teams were using.

Low capy mags. What a joke. I can change a 6 shot semi-auto mag vastly quicker than I can a revolver; few mass shooters are going to take the substantial time and trouble to learn to reload wheelguns quickly. And then when low capy mag restrictions, along with other Balkanized regulations, fail the folks who oppose regulation will be able to say "see, gun laws don't work"; it's perfect for them.

We will see a reduction in mass shootings when we have reduced the population of semi autos to a tiny fraction of what it is now, and not a day sooner. A national health care system, better worker protections, breaking up oligopolies/strong anti-trust enforcement and the like would also be of benefit to this problem and society in general...but no, as I said, we are a stupid lot and both parties are beholden to big $$ interests. We are like the frog in the water that's being slowly heated, and about way too many things.

Conceptually this is not a difficult problem but practically we've damn sure made it one.

but freeeedddddummmmmbbbbbb. it seems to be simple to some of us. but guns are powerful psychological tools that change the way people think, i guess, or else how would we be here?

[Vandenberg]

Speaking as an outsider, it appears the USA is past the point of no return when it comes to gun deaths. There are simply too many guns already in circulation, and too many people who see guns as some sort of symbol of freedom, for any kind of ban and buy-back solution to be successful. There's something deeply wrong with the American psyche for the desire of weapons of death and destruction to be so prevalent and so mainstream.


That said, y'all really need to try something, anything. Draw a line in the sand, start with banning the most heinous of these weapons, then work from there.

[ides1056]

I was not meaning to be ironic in my prior post regarding Walmart, but it is an unfortunate fact that this is wheat leadership looks like in the US, where corporations write legislation, and act according to the dictates of their bottom line if not common sense and decency.

We had a town meeting last night to address a comprehensive rewriting of our bylaws to make them easier to use. One outstanding issue that has not been addressed regards accessory apartments, which are not permitted. Yet fully 20% of the housing stock in town has them. I figure if we draft legislation and attempt to enforce it, our town will be destroyed in meaningful ways.

[jclay]

There's something deeply wrong with the American psyche for the desire of weapons of death and destruction to be so prevalent and so mainstream.

I could not agree with you more.

[TTX1]