Let it RIP

[Human Epic Jolt]

OK.

E=MCsquared*. for lack of a button.


if I'm not mistaken then this is basically proven false.

for the purposes of science mass is calculated at one point.

things aren't at one point in reality.

someone teach me something please.

[Nathanrtaylor]

I can't quite figure out what you are asking, but basically yeah, that equation as written is false. Or at least a bit misleading.
The full equation incorporates momentum as well, and is written something like this:

E² = (m₀c²)² + (pc)²


It's basically the pythagorean theorem, but with energy, mass, and momentum (p) taking the place of side A, side B, and the hypotenuse (Energy)


Once we've added momentum into the equation, it makes (a bit) more sense. Take a photon for instance. Nearly zero mass, but momentum near the speed of light. That cuts out the (m₀c²)² part of the equation completely, leaving:

E² = (pc)² or taking the square root: E = pc


In other words, the energy of a photon is it's momentum times the speed of light. Or just the speed of light since it can't exceed that. Pretty well defines a photon, huh?


The other important thing to understand about this equation is that it references the motion and mass of particles, not things like, say, locomotives. In purely physical terms, particles can be argued to have all of their mass in one point at their geometric center.


(actually, in purely physical terms, almost everything can be argued to have all of it's mass existing in it's geometric center. Even though the Earth is 22,000 miles in diameter, the gravitational effect that it's huge mass exerts on the moon is as if all of it's mass was in the exact geometric center of the Earth. In fact, if you somehow replaced the Earth with a really tiny black hole the size of a pea, but with the same mass as the Earth, the moon would continue to orbit as if nothing happened. But I digress)


When Einstein postulated this equation, it explained a bunch of stuff that had been observed via experiment better than a lot of theories that had come before it. For instance, scientists had known for decades that certain elements gave off radiation in the form of gamma rays, stray electrons (beta radiation), and helium nuclei (alpha radiation). What Einstein's equation suggested was that the samples of elements giving off this radiation should also be decreasing in mass every so slightly. It took many more years before this fact was proven via experiment.


Did that let it Rip?

[steve garro]

I keep trying to visualise the imprint and effects of the two meteors & the interaction with the Earth & the Moon in the fabric of space/time in 3D while I work, the gravitational displacements in a 3D net of gravity........
Makes the day go by.
- Garro.

[MacLaughlin]

Shift-6 is the carat ("^"), which is used to designate exponents, as in "E=mc^2."

A superscript 2, as in "E=mc²," can be typed in windows using ALT+0178 (Mac is probably apple-option-something, but I don't care enough to look it up).

Just so you know that you never lack any buttons.

Garro: Just for reference, the Russian Meteor approached Earth from the Sun-facing direction and hit the part of the planet facing "forward" (relative to the direction of Earth's travel) traveling east to west The big bad asteroid that missed us was flying from "below" to "above," and skimmed us along the dark side of the planet (which was the same side as the meteor, but ~16hrs laters). Now couple in the fact that the Sun is moving along an orbit as well. I only mention all this because I enjoy the same kind of mental gymnastics.

[dancinkozmo]

trying to read and understand these posts has given me a headache...must go watch TV now.

[SteveP]

these guys saw the freakin' doofs post on baggy shorts and figured anything goes on this forum.
jayysus.

[Saab2000]

I'm surprised that President Putin didn't ride a Pegasus (shirtless of course) to guide the meteor safely to the ocean. Or at least fly a Sukhoi fighter jet to shoot that mofo down.

[MacLaughlin]

He's Putin, not Kim Jong Un (who was in fact responsible for the glorious space rock lights in the sky).

[Shoogs]

Sweet Brown ain't got time for this or that.

[Saab2000]

He's Putin, not Kim Jong Un (who was in fact responsible for the glorious space rock lights in the sky).

Good point. Putin is, after all, human. I had forgotten the Kim family of deities.

[Nathanrtaylor]

I have a sneaking suspicion that I got thread trolled by HEJ, but I just. couldn't. resist.

it would have been much, much worse had I been drinking.

[Nierman]

Rudolph Clausius was where it's at, anyway.

[bellman]

I have a sneaking suspicion that I got thread trolled by HEJ, but I just. couldn't. resist.

it would have been much, much worse had I been drinking.

Its ok, you said more in one post then 'he's' said in 2000. We enjoyed it.

[Human Epic Jolt]

When Einstein postulated this equation, it explained a bunch of stuff that had been observed via experiment better than a lot of theories that had come before it. For instance, scientists had known for decades that certain elements gave off radiation in the form of gamma rays, stray electrons (beta radiation), and helium nuclei (alpha radiation). What Einstein's equation suggested was that the samples of elements giving off this radiation should also be decreasing in mass every so slightly. It took many more years before this fact was proven via experiment.

So how did Einstein prove it?

[Human Epic Jolt]

and thanks for the reply. it's interesting.

[MacLaughlin]

"...in 1932[, seventeen years after being introduced,] with the discovery of the neutron and its mass, allowing mass differences for single nuclides and their reactions to be calculated directly, and compared with the sum of masses for the particles that made up their composition. In 1933, the energy released from the reaction of lithium-7 plus protons giving rise to 2 alpha particles (as noted above by Rutherford), allowed Einstein's equation to be tested to an error of ± 0.5%."

Mass

[Human Epic Jolt]

"...in 1932[, seventeen years after being introduced,] with the discovery of the neutron and its mass, allowing mass differences for single nuclides and their reactions to be calculated directly, and compared with the sum of masses for the particles that made up their composition. In 1933, the energy released from the reaction of lithium-7 plus protons giving rise to 2 alpha particles (as noted above by Rutherford), allowed Einstein's equation to be tested to an error of ± 0.5%."

Mass

I think your missing my point. It's been proven.

[Nathanrtaylor]

So how did Einstein prove it?

He didn't. Theoretician vs experimentalist. I doubt Einstein ever proved anything.

In that same vein. This is one of my most favorite statements on the scientific method. Feynman is one of my heroes.

[Human Epic Jolt]

Engineering is similar.
'cept academics won't believe it.

[rydesteel]

Lucifers Hammer by Larry Niven, I belive that was the reference in the first post. Dude's in the kitchen with a mound of flour throwing objects into it they all make round holes...the globe is spinning next to him, Very cool book.