Offset or non-offset seatposts

[jerk]

I have used the Turbomatics for so long I can hardly remember using anything else. I Flites before that and I have tried but cannot really use them anymore. The Turbomatics are better. But they do indeed have really short rails. And you are right that I cannot get into the proper position unless they are totally slammed back.

Someday I'll have to try a modern saddle, like something from within the past 15 years or so, like a Fizik Aliante, and see what the fuss is all about.

don't bother. they're too soft, too short and they'll make your dick fall off.

http://www.velocipedesalon.com/forum...mtb-11117.html

[Saab2000]

Actually I think I meant the Arione. The Aliante is too soft. But the Arione seems decent from what I've seen.

[Christian Fox]

im trying to stay away...
when hacks like us try to look like michele bartoli on the bike...
it just doesnt happen that way..

of course it's stupid to think we'll look like him, but there is something to be gained in observing (and trying to emulate a tiny fraction of) what the ideal is. if more people did that than simply repeating their shitty habits the world would have a lot of better athletes.

[davids]

what would you rather talk about on a bicycle forum? using rabbit ear antenna? citibank a good investment? compression socks? john lennon?

Honda is killing the Element and no one here seems to care.

[jerk]

steve-
my mother said i look even more handsome than michele bartoli. why are you calling my mother a liar?
my friend flux told me i ride faster down hill than michele bartoli ever rode up alpe d'huez. are you calling my friend a liar?

im trying to stay away...
when hacks like us try to look like michele bartoli on the bike...
it just doesnt happen that way..
he was one of the sweetest positioned riders in the last 20 years.
he was 30 yrs old and a freak of nature.
forget bartoli. its ludicrous for his name to come up in a conversation like this.
we are playing soft pitch mixed gender softball here.
we are not batting against mariano rivera with 2 outs in game 7.

look at the bright side.
1/2 of us morons look better than johan museeuw on the bike and practically everyone here looks better than sean kelly on the bike.

also note.
it would be interesting to see bartoli or bettini riding and their position now since they have retired... assuming they still ride.
that would be far more appropriate to the conversation.

note. i am positive a 55 yr old moser still looks as good as he did when he was 29. dont include him in this.

[mainemike]

im trying to stay away...
when hacks like us try to look like michele bartoli on the bike...
it just doesnt happen that way..
he was one of the sweetest positioned riders in the last 20 years.
he was 30 yrs old and a freak of nature.
forget bartoli. its ludicrous for his name to come up in a conversation like this.
we are playing soft pitch mixed gender softball here.
we are not batting against mariano rivera with 2 outs in game 7.

look at the bright side.
1/2 of us morons look better than johan museeuw on the bike and practically everyone here looks better than sean kelly on the bike.

also note.
it would be interesting to see bartoli or bettini riding and their position now since they have retired... assuming they still ride.
that would be far more appropriate to the conversation.

note. i am positive a 55 yr old moser still looks as good as he did when he was 29. dont include him in this.

kelly looking good here. of course you can't see him very well!

[sam]

I am really enjoying this thread. It can be a company, an industry, a pro rider, or the guy down the street- just because its done does not mean its right, and even pros fall for marketing, trends, and kool-aid. Every time a customer ask me why he does not look like so-and-so rider, I say cause your not him, now go ride your bike. It think saddles should be on linear motion rails- and will slide to the sweet spot for you-hahaha

[54ny77]

speaking of boxy cars, this is one of my favorite ads of the year:



catchy tune, hilarious body antics of the hamsters.

Honda is killing the Element and no one here seems to care.

[ergott]

we are not batting against mariano rivera with 2 outs in game 7.

Say it loud. Say it proud!

-Eric

[WFSTEKL]

kelly looking good here. of course you can't see him very well!

Is that pic from Montreal in '89?

[Flux]

it would be interesting to see bartoli or bettini riding and their position now since they have retired... assuming they still ride.
that would be far more appropriate to the conversation.

the day would not be complete if i did not agitate someone on the interweb.

here is bartoli now: ITALIAN CYCLING JOURNAL: Michele Bartoli Recons Giro's Stage 7

are those 28's he's riding? where the heck are his fenders!?

[Sasha]

To summarize what I have gleaned from this thread:
*Some pros put their saddles all the way back to achieve a more smooth, yet powerful pedal stroke, then move up to the nose when they really want to hammer.
*Some pros have custom bikes that slam the saddle all the way back in order to minimize the fine tuning of setback every time you ship or dismantle the bike. (slam it back, adjust the height and go)

Other maxims:
*I will never look like Michele Bartoli on a bike.
*For the independent contract racer, some degree of fore/aft adjustment is a good thing.
*Sacha White, Richie, Dazza, Goodrich, and Gaulzetti encourage you to clamp your saddle in the center of the rails.
*Offset or non-offset posts are both fine depending on your fashion sense, but the bike should be designed with this fashion in mind.

Then I see something like this, which throws it all into question.

[SteveP]

Say it loud. Say it proud!

-Eric

sorry eric
that was the division series this year... not the same yo.

[54ny77]

jeter makes more in 1 year than 3/4 of the entire world pro cycling peloton.

alright, fine, i made that up.

but i'd guess he makes more in 1 year than the entire u.s. pro peloton (domestic racers, that is).

not bad for a 37 year old with mediocre numbers.

[mainemike]

Is that pic from Montreal in '89?

i think its 91?

[Dazza]

@ Saab; as a fellow Turbomatic user I agree they are a badass saddle but maybe a bad example for this silly thread. They have super short rails and they are set way back on the saddle so they are almost unridable unless you slam them back. Which brings up a great point for those who hate the look of a zero post but anatomy say's they need it, try a Turbomatic since the useable tail portion is very short and will move you forward. Setback or zero; saddle plays into it more than you would think.

Cannot believe I got sucked into this one too!

This does not make sense.
The problem is your frame and or your seat post with the Turbo seat
the frame does not have enough set back for the post to hold the saddle at the correct set back for you so you push it back, complicated more by the type of saddle and it's dimensions
so if I build you a frame with a 74 degree seat tube and you use a Campy post you will push it all the way back
then you get a frame with a 72 degree seat tube and you still push it all the way back even if it is 30mm more?
Agreement that some saddles do not have much rail room
and all saddles have the straight part of the rails in a different position.
and all saddles will change your pelvis location
so get your fit up done with the saddle you intend to use.

[Human Epic Jolt]

one of the first modern no offset posts i remember was made by USE for MTBs.

i never had the impression it had been put on the market to solve a fit issue.

it seemed to me to be an engineering solution. lightweight machined parts were in fashion. not easy to machine a post with setback.

hence the non offset.

in my eyes.

[Dazza]

im trying to stay away...
when hacks like us try to look like michele bartoli on the bike...
it just doesnt happen that way..
he was one of the sweetest positioned riders in the last 20 years.
he was 30 yrs old and a freak of nature.
forget bartoli. its ludicrous for his name to come up in a conversation like this.
we are playing soft pitch mixed gender softball here.
we are not batting against mariano rivera with 2 outs in game 7.

look at the bright side.
1/2 of us morons look better than johan museeuw on the bike and practically everyone here looks better than sean kelly on the bike.

also note.
it would be interesting to see bartoli or bettini riding and their position now since they have retired... assuming they still ride.
that would be far more appropriate to the conversation.

note. i am positive a 55 yr old moser still looks as good as he did when he was 29. dont include him in this.

some one talking sense!

Determine the position data (I am not entering into a discussion about this)
using the saddle and the seat post the rider will use (I use the Campy seat post as my default)
design the frame to fit under that for the bike's intended use
The care and experience of the designer/builder is the important aspect of this process.
If the design aims at mid rail for the components selected, then there is room to alter if saddles change or posture/fitness changes etc etc blah blah.

I will add, I did not want to look like Lucian Van Impe, but I sure wanted to be able to ride up mountains like him when I was a wee lad

and another thing, the current fashion of tipping the bars up and having the lever hoods plonked up very high on the bends to mimick MTB bar ends I think is because most of the time the bars are getting too low
and even reaching the brake levers from the drops becomes difficult on descents.......................................... .................

[corsa,inc]

This multimillion dollar industry is not built on frames for pro riders it's to sell to middle age fat men. The bikes are light and fast to give us a sense of what that feels like, not the professionals. Pro riders are sizing down two frames so than can be aero since our fat asses can't bend over. Example: Pro rider- sizes down frame still no headset spacers. Non-pro- correct size frame still has to have 40cm of spacers.
I believe we're still in the slam it back and frame as small as possible era. We're all the victim of fashion because I highly doubt we all went from quill stem and 2cm of drop to threadless and 8cm of drop. I doubt human evolution moves that quickly. Yes the roads are better now but let's be honest we're all about the pageantry.
By the way, framebuilder's are no longer in the peloton unless your name is Tom Boonen, everyone else gets Mr. Lee's pretty good carbon frame with marketing/design firm X on it.

[spicoli]

If you ever for some reason have to, don't bother with the inbetween stuff of the last 15 years. I've done them and they sukk. Either keep the old Turbomatics rockin or become an old fartass like me and get an SMP when your grundle gives out! I've ridden so many different saddles lately and the only two that work for my ass are Turbomatics and the ugly ass SMP's. I'd love to be able to ride any saddle I can but at this point of my life I cannot. 90% of the new crap is so narrow with tiny sweetspots I have no idea how people can ride on there soft bits that way?

I have used the Turbomatics for so long I can hardly remember using anything else. I Flites before that and I have tried but cannot really use them anymore. The Turbomatics are better. But they do indeed have really short rails. And you are right that I cannot get into the proper position unless they are totally slammed back.

Someday I'll have to try a modern saddle, like something from within the past 15 years or so, like a Fizik Aliante, and see what the fuss is all about.