Any American Ex-Pats here? We are heavily considering...

[sk_tle]

Chances are, if you leave the US you're going to be going to someplace significantly worse, unless you're really going far.

It depends if you take into accounts the odds of getting shot. I happily trade a bit of corruption with not having hyper paranoïd law enforcement and a whole part of the population ready to shoot me for whichever stupid reason (or because they are drunk or stoned).

[ElvisMerckx]

It depends if you take into accounts the odds of getting shot. I happily trade a bit of corruption with not having hyper paranoïd law enforcement and a whole part of the population ready to shoot me for whichever stupid reason (or because they are drunk or stoned).

The odds of getting shot in the States is actually extremely low if you know the places, times of day, and activities to avoid. Not sure who's "ready to shoot" you.

Anecdotally, I've lived in the States about 95% of my life and I've witnessed gun violence twice: The first time was a Russian shooting at a wall sconce in a bar in Prague, Czech Republic; the second was a murder outside a nightclub in Malmo, Sweden.

[Will Neide]

It depends if you take into accounts the odds of getting shot. I happily trade a bit of corruption with not having hyper paranoïd law enforcement and a whole part of the population ready to shoot me for whichever stupid reason (or because they are drunk or stoned).

Which part of the population is ready to shoot you? I've been here my whole life (40 years) and have never personally seen any gun violence. It clearly happens, but I'm not sure you've spent any considerable time in the states.

[rec head]

I've seen a lot. A real lot. Enough to make me want to leave.

[Saab2000]

I've seen a lot. A real lot. Enough to make me want to leave.

The kind of ugliness we have seen in recent years is neither unprecedented nor unique to the US. Are there places without these issues? Yes. But they have other issues. And often more or less the same issues just disguised as something else.

There is no perfect place.



Which is not to say that the OP or anyone else shouldn’t try someplace else. There’s much to be gained by walking in different shoes and seeing the world through a different lens.

[j44ke]

Part of the joy and frustration of living somewhere else is the difference, not the better or worse.

So nice to do things like take a vacation 3 or 4 times a year! Maybe 6! For example...

[johnmdesigner]

I was lucky in that I got to see the world when I was young. My experiences had a profound effect on my life.
I think you have a different set of expectations when you are older and traveling.
I lived and worked in France, Italy and the Netherlands before and after EU.
You are lucky in that you have a companion to share your experiences with. I was alone and dealing with the bureaucracy and customs of a country on your own is a rough ride.
I learned a few things;
First, the natives have a hard enough time navigating the bureaucracy. It's going to be twice as hard for you.
You have to be really outgoing in your personality. I was quite shy at first and found it hard to make friends.
No matter how well you speak the language you will always be an outsider.
There is a point in time where you change from being an American into something else. It takes a long time and along the way you may experience depression, loneliness and confusion.
I remember once in Rotterdam on a very cold winter night at the height of my business difficulties sitting along a frozen canal on a park bench crying. I came back to New York.
That was my first attempt at European life. I had several successful ones after that.
My advice to you is to throw out everything you thought you knew about the world and let the world come to you.
Humans are the same wherever you go. Help your neighbor out and you'll probably get an invitation to the best meal you ever had.

[Dave Thompson]

I was lucky in that I got to see the world when I was young. My experiences had a profound effect on my life.
I think you have a different set of expectations when you are older and traveling.
I lived and worked in France, Italy and the Netherlands before and after EU.
You are lucky in that you have a companion to share your experiences with. I was alone and dealing with the bureaucracy and customs of a country on your own is a rough ride.
I learned a few things;
First, the natives have a hard enough time navigating the bureaucracy. It's going to be twice as hard for you.
You have to be really outgoing in your personality. I was quite shy at first and found it hard to make friends.
No matter how well you speak the language you will always be an outsider.
There is a point in time where you change from being an American into something else. It takes a long time and along the way you may experience depression, loneliness and confusion.
I remember once in Rotterdam on a very cold winter night at the height of my business difficulties sitting along a frozen canal on a park bench crying. I came back to New York.
That was my first attempt at European life. I had several successful ones after that.
My advice to you is to throw out everything you thought you knew about the world and let the world come to you.
Humans are the same wherever you go. Help your neighbor out and you'll probably get an invitation to the best meal you ever had.

Best damn advice, ever!

[rwsaunders]

I've seen a lot. A real lot. Enough to make me want to leave.

Sadly Thomas’ comment isn’t too far off...from a 2018 archived piece in the Seattle Times.

Just six countries that make up less than 10 percent of the world’s population — Brazil, the United States, Mexico, Colombia, Venezuela and Guatemala — accounted for just over half of the world’s gun-related deaths. The United States had about 1,060 gun-related deaths per 1 million people...this includes gun-related suicides as well.

[Chik]

The first time I visited the US was when I got to Philadelphia to spend the summer at U Penn. We were housed in a dorm at the edge of campus. Across the lawn and the road, on the corner of Walnut and S40th, there was a Burger King (or was it McD?). The first weekend, there was a fatal shooting at the joint.

That was stuff I've seen only in films.

Talk about adjustment.

[classtimesailer]

Martin? Are you intending to become a citizen of your new country? I didn't google ex-pat. Are there countries that are offering you citizenship? Is there a country that has need of your skill set or saving$? My wife is coming around to my way of thinking but she is too proud of her credit score to totally abandon this place. If the rightward shift here is driving you out, which leftist countries would you feel comfortable defending.

[ElvisMerckx]

Sadly Thomas’ comment isn’t too far off...from a 2018 archived piece in the Seattle Times.

Just six countries that make up less than 10 percent of the world’s population — Brazil, the United States, Mexico, Colombia, Venezuela and Guatemala — accounted for just over half of the world’s gun-related deaths. The United States had about 1,060 gun-related deaths per 1 million people...this includes gun-related suicides as well.

So why not just compare homicide rates? Would the statistic have less punch?

[rwsaunders]

So why not just compare homicide rates? Would the statistic have less punch?

1/2 are murders and 1/2 are suicides....appx 40,000 total. I didn’t look up plain old shootings.

https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/fastats/homicide.htm

[echappist]

The first time I visited the US was when I got to Philadelphia to spend the summer at U Penn. We were housed in a dorm at the edge of campus. Across the lawn and the road, on the corner of Walnut and S40th, there was a Burger King (or was it McD?). The first weekend, there was a fatal shooting at the joint.

That was stuff I've seen only in films.

Talk about adjustment.

Apologies about going off tangent here.

That whole area was quite dangerous up til the late 1990's, and there were quite a few (as in more than five) Penn students who were murdered in the fifteen years spanning 1985 to 2000. Penn finally realized that such a reputation was detrimental to its own self interest and decided to clean things up a bit. These days, the area south of Spruce and west of 38th has gentrified quite a bit (to the point that I probably wouldn't mind being out walking at night), but I'd still be careful venturing west past the 3800 block of Walnut Street at night.

[j44ke]

Let's see if we can bring this thread back around to the OP's query.

One of my favorite ambassadorial moments in Prague was explaining what the United States was like by showing photos of all the places I have lived in the US, including Arizona, during which I learned that the people at the table, educated, well-traveled in Europe, had all formed most of their impressions of the US from the books of Karl May.

Another was watching a US reporter on CNN in an armored personnel carrier heading up a wide boulevard into Baghdad saying "Not experiencing any gunfire, the streets are deserted" and then turning over to France5 and seeing their reporter retreating down a wide boulevard with a group of Iraqi "irregulars" who were firing a machine gun from the back of a truck saying "We can see the tanks at the end of the road."

And one of the best is meeting people who became dear friends, whose kids grew up, traveled to the US and stayed with us, who then became friends as well, and then became parents and now have visited with their kids who treat us like family and who we miss seeing like they were our own grandkids.

[ElvisMerckx]

1/2 are murders and 1/2 are suicides....appx 40,000 total. I didn’t look up plain old shootings.

https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/fastats/homicide.htm

According to that source, 62.4% are suicides and 37.6% are murders. Not going to say there isn't a gun problem in the US, but the Seattle Times is gaming the stats for more dramatic numbers.

After my post earlier about the positives I've found living in the States over abroad, one HUGE negative is TERRIBLE media: sensationalist, tabloidal, fear-mongering, and irresponsible.

[ElvisMerckx]

... I learned that the people at the table, educated, well-traveled in Europe, had all formed most of their impressions of the US from the books of Karl May.
.

I experienced the same thing during my year in Prague and year and a half in Berlin. Everyone was shocked I'd never read Karl May (they assumed he was American). And I was always perplexed by their 100% negative and hostile feelings toward cowboys.

[johnmdesigner]

i was doing business in Paris at the beginning of the first Iraq war.
The French were pretty hostile towards anyone from the US at the time.
I tried to diffuse the situation by describing my visit to the Louvre the day before.
I had a delicious meal that night and shared my thoughts about the meal and the wine. I think they were a little shocked.
Lots of people form opinions about you from the media. Many of them are shocked to find out you are not as bad as they were led to believe.
Years ago I met an Israeli couple on the subway. We all left enlightened about our different lives and what we thought they were like.
I was in Istanbul just after Ergodan was elected. The people were so excited and happy at the direction the country was taking.
Look what happened...
All the Turks I met were such wonderful people. I feel so bad for them. I want to go back and find out how they are doing.

[Chik]

If owning your residence is important to you, then check to see if that country allows foreigners to own real properties. Of course, you probably can buy a place through a proxy, but it entails having all the obvious risks down the road. Thailand jumps to mind although the laws may have changed in recent years.

Speaking of properties and Czechia, I know a non-Czech company that owned a building in Prague, rented it out to commercial tenants, paid taxes arising from the ownership and rental of the property, and when it came to selling the building, they were found to be lacking a minor document that the original seller, who no longer exists, neglected to provide. They were in court for nearly a decade to establish their rightful ownership. Fun stuff.

[j44ke]

If owning your residence is important to you, then check to see if that country allows foreigners to own real properties. Of course, you probably can buy a place through a proxy, but it entails having all the obvious risks down the road. Thailand jumps to mind although the laws may have changed in recent years.

Speaking of properties and Czechia, I know a non-Czech company that owned a building in Prague, rented it out to commercial tenants, paid taxes arising from the ownership and rental of the property, and when it came to selling the building, they were found to be lacking a minor document that the original seller, who no longer exists, neglected to provide. They were in court for nearly a decade to establish their rightful ownership. Fun stuff.

Yes. My wife's work involved privatization of one of the major banks, tunneling of assets by a major investment house, and illegal sale of a famous Czech brewery through lightning fast transactions that involved multiple shell companies etc. etc. etc. Plus friends & their families had buildings stolen in 1938, 1949, etc. etc. etc. So we're familiar with the irregularities of the irregularities. Ever read Utz by Bruce Chatwin?