The Vaccine Thread

[beeatnik]

Let's not get into long covid....


That said I'd like to see studies into the long term sequelae of Covid-19 infection in the most impacted group in the United States, low SES Latinx in Southern California. This high disease burden population was younger, larger and more immune naive (pre-vaccine period infections) than any other in the western (developed) world. Anecdotally long covid rates are orders of magnitude lower than those reported in places such as the UK.

[Octave]

Thank you. When people ask why I'm still taking a high level of precaution, it's this. I'd rather not be a test case for C19 survivorship (or worse). Of course that means I'm a test case for the effects of social isolation and a little light family estrangement... sigh, these times sure are fun.

Agreed. As someone who spends his working hours studying this disease, and in particular in drug development for the prevention of long-term symptomology like lung fibrosis and organ failure amongst COVID survivors, I do not believe that numbers re: deaths alone tell a sufficient picture. We will see this disease play out in the worldwide population many years after infections and death rates are negligible.

Let's not get into long covid....


That said I'd like to see studies into the long term sequelae of Covid-19 infection in the most impacted group in the United States, low SES Latinx in Southern California. This high disease burden population was younger, larger and more immune naive (pre-vaccine period infections) than any other in the western (developed) world. Anecdotally long covid rates are orders of magnitude lower than those reported in places such as the UK.

Why not get into long COVID? It is a significant factor in this pandemic and an important part of the risk assessments that people are currently making as to how they live their lives while high levels of the virus remain circulating.

As for your anecdote on the long-term symptoms in low SES Latinx in SoCal: the plural of anecdote is not data. Period. You were, mere days ago, championing the UK's monitoring and reporting system for COVID. Now you choose to question it in favor of anecdotes? This is cherry-picking to an egregious degree. Listen to the data, not anecdotes.

[zachateseverything]

Colin Powell had prostate cancer, Parkinson's, plus an incurable type of blood cancer called multiple myeloma. This is the problem that I have with statistics, and I know someone linked to an excellent The Economist article earlier in this thread re: excess deaths, but that's a reach to attribute Powell's death to covid. He was 84, immunocompromised, and could've succumbed to a Taco Bell fart. What's more, the media has used his obit to push the vaccine narrative which is flagrant opportunism.

Are there other examples where, say, you have a cold and you're in a plane crash yet your death is labeled due to a common cold, just completely ignoring the elephant in the room, or is the cause of all deaths subjective? I'm not trolling or mocking Powell's death (I was weaned on Nachos BellGrande) but at some point we've got to revert to calling a spade a spade. Another example, this summer in Spain I read a headline that there were 4,000 covid deaths and the average age was 80. Apparently dying of old age doesn't exist anymore just like there was no flu, people didn't catch the common cold because of masks, etc. I believe the scope and severity of covid to the general population has been over exaggerated and irresponsibly reported from day one. I have friends who say they're going to wear a mask for the rest of their lives; I know people who still clean surfaces obsessively; others don't take public transportation and on and on.

Covid but have been the proverbial last straw but it's still what killed Colin Powell. It is absolutely true that we need to get more people vaccinated such that those who are immunocompromised are at lower risk.

the risk Covid poses to the general population, particularly with the more virulent delta variation has absolutely not been overblown. Pre-vaccine we saw hospital systems in multiple countries being pushed to the brink even with fairly significant social distancing policies being maintained. We also have seen the same thing post-vaccine in areas with low vaccination rates (either from people opting out or from gov being unable to gain supply).

the best thing everyone can do if they want life to return to something approaching 2019 is to get vaccinated.

[beeatnik]

Octave, I was being a bit facetious. And, yes, UK data seems to be all over the place on Long Covid.

Ironically, due to my interpretation of the early (now mostly “discredited”) long Covid numbers, I convinced my cancer survivor wife to get vaccinated. She still contracted a serious mild case of Covid-19; VO2 looks good tho.

[jimcav]

I'm a bit depressed about long-Covid, as I have the heart rate issues and much milder concentration/recall stuff. I can't do anything now but wait and hope it gets better. Reading pre-publish stuff of what they suspect or can find so far hasn't shown anything that I can actually do something about it, but I'll keep reading and hoping.

We have to use the data that exists. Unfortunately I see short term that the best data will come from countries that have the infrastructure and $ to do the research or have the existing data from a robust healthcare system. That means some of the disadvantaged and underserved populations won't have good data. Many in these populations are less likely to seek care here--they are the same populations with no safety net to be sick from work, and little access to healthcare, and for some they have fear of healthcare being tied to other gov't systems.

Based mostly on anecdotes, I'm hoping to get a Moderna booster, having had Pfizer 1-2. Solely in the hope it does something better with my post-Covid HR issues, some are reporting it does, but it really doesn't amount to data. Hope is the thing with feathers after all.

[sk_tle]

I have friends who say they're going to wear a mask for the rest of their lives

Not sure about open air, but wearing a mask in public transports and crowded commercial areas looks to me like it could be called common sense in a few decades. Hey if you look at some asian countries they were already doing it whenever some breath disease symptoms were appearing.

I also catched covid, probably due to my partner's job but I also found out I have been less sick these last 2 years than I used to.

Aside from the 87,000+ people who have died there, that leaves millions with lasting symptoms that may prevent them from functioning properly in their work, their family and home life, and as a general participant in society. [...]

I'm not sure how that severity has been overstated.

Even I as someone considered not in a particular risk group feel some symptoms that may be due to long-covid. I can't be 100% positive, I guess only statistics help in that area, not individual assessments.

[bigbill]

I had an appointment at the local hospital this morning. A security guy screens everyone as they enter and will provide a mask to those without. When I left, the security guy was having a confrontation with a woman who refused to wear a mask because Covid was a lie created by the government to control us. You could see the weariness in the eyes of the security guard and staff. I can hardly wait to retire and move to BFE, Wyoming and avoid people.

[Saab2000]

Meanwhile, a booster has been approved for the US for the big three vaccines in the States. I went to Walgreens this morning hoping to sign up for an appointment out in the future but they had no information yet. Hopefully soon. I start back to work tomorrow and will have the “opportunity” to work with a few folks who aren’t vaccinated. The mandate is coming soon and a lot of folks will be applying for exemptions, most, but not all, of which I expect will be denied. I’ll be curious if folks will actually give up good careers over this. I’m a good sheep and reported my status to my employer as soon as they asked for it.

[j44ke]

Meanwhile, a booster has been approved for the US for the big three vaccines in the States. I went to Walgreens this morning hoping to sign up for an appointment out in the future but they had no information yet. Hopefully soon. I start back to work tomorrow and will have the “opportunity” to work with a few folks who aren’t vaccinated. The mandate is coming soon and a lot of folks will be applying for exemptions, most, but not all, of which I expect will be denied. I’ll be curious if folks will actually give up good careers over this. I’m a good sheep and reported my status to my employer as soon as they asked for it.

Currently over 65 only (or risk due to health or work.) Feds are considering lowering it to 40. All Johnson & Johnson recipients can get a booster (mix/match brand/type allowed) 2 months after their initial vaccine.

https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019...ster-shot.html

https://www.yalemedicine.org/news/jo...-covid-booster

[Saab2000]

Currently over 65 only (or risk due to health or work.) Feds are considering lowering it to 40. All Johnson & Johnson recipients can get a booster (mix/match brand/type allowed) 2 months after their initial vaccine.

https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019...ster-shot.html

https://www.yalemedicine.org/news/jo...-covid-booster

People who work in jobs where potential exposure risk is elevated, and this includes transportation workers, will also be eligible.

[gregl]

People who work in jobs where potential exposure risk is elevated, and this includes transportation workers, will also be eligible.

My daughter is student teaching this fall. She was notified that she is eligible for a booster because of her near-constant exposure to unvaccinated young people. She is thinking over whether at age 22 and healthy, she should wait her turn in line until people with greater health risks get their boosters first. Since booster availability is good in our area, I suggested that she make her decision based on risk assessment rather than deferring. At 57 and healthy, I plan to get a booster as soon as it’s available for my demographic.

My workplace is covered under the Government contractor mandate. It will be interesting to see who won’t be there on December 9. I suspect a handful (3-5%) from my department will decide to leave the industry. They can’t go to work for any of our competitors, work as independents contractors, or work remotely. Their beliefs are forcing them out of well-paying careers.

Greg

[j44ke]

People who work in jobs where potential exposure risk is elevated, and this includes transportation workers, will also be eligible.

Ah, of course, didn't realize you were back to piloting planes! I'll start waving from the backyard again.

[robin3mj]

I’m getting my third Pfizer jab tomorrow. Second was about eight months ago.

Not personally worried about my own exposure but I need to start getting back out into our senior living communities and figure getting the booster now provides that slight extra protection- both for those I come into contact with, and for my own kids who will hopefully be getting theirs soon (but not soon enough).

[darkmother]

My workplace has adopted a policy whereby employees (or contractors) not fully vaccinated are denied access to the work site as of Nov 1. I know of several employees who have stated that they are unwilling to take the vaccine.

I have a feeling this is going to get ugly fast.

[Saab2000]

Ah, of course, didn't realize you were back to piloting planes! I'll start waving from the backyard again.

I am. And today was thrown in at the deep end. Knocking the rust off. Very first flight back resulted in a go-around, having lost visual runway contact at 150’ due to some of the heaviest rain in south Florida I’ve ever seen. Visual approach later to DCA was, thankfully, uneventful. But the last year had been a great dress rehearsal for retirement!

[Matthew Strongin]

I am. And today was thrown in at the deep end. Knocking the rust off. Very first flight back resulted in a go-around, having lost visual runway contact at 150’ due to some of the heaviest rain in south Florida I’ve ever seen. Visual approach later to DCA was, thankfully, uneventful. But the last year had been a great dress rehearsal for retirement!

Dude, where were you? MIA or FLL? It was pouring like crazy here today.

[Saab2000]

Dude, where were you? MIA or FLL? It was pouring like crazy here today.

FLL. The floodgates were opened from above. MIA next week. Funny thing is that 30-40 miles west of that area it was mostly dry. Southwest Florida was dry.

Florida weather can be crazy. Very much a love/hate relationship for this Yankee!

[j44ke]

I am. And today was thrown in at the deep end. Knocking the rust off. Very first flight back resulted in a go-around, having lost visual runway contact at 150’ due to some of the heaviest rain in south Florida I’ve ever seen. Visual approach later to DCA was, thankfully, uneventful. But the last year had been a great dress rehearsal for retirement!

All in a day's work, eh? Honk when you're over Hillsdale.

[beeatnik]

Boosters for some (many) and maybe only one shot for others?

https://www.instagram.com/kylewarnermtb/?hl=en



https://mobile.twitter.com/JHowardBr...86845120147467

[spopepro]

I’m getting my third Pfizer jab tomorrow. Second was about eight months ago.

How did it go for you? I got my 3rd dose yesterday and holy shit it was painful. I remarked that it was about one-third of a bout with sepsis (which I have the misfortune of experience to measure against) but all the same s/sx. Brutal. Still hurt 36h later but starting to feel better.

At least I have confirmation of a robust immune response?