2020 Political Chatter

[colker]

I'm sure that is accurate. He is just the natural result of the party which started with the animosity of Newt Gingrich in the 90's, the tea party post-financial crisis leading to Trump and QAnon.

Newt Gingrich was on FOX News saying the election was stolen and was financed by people like George Soros. I think the last bastion of true conservatism probably passed away with John McCain. Even the National Review which was the standard bearer for conservatism is Trumpier....

These guys won´t quiet down; they are probably hoping for more cash to maintain their vitriol. As much as a tolerant stance from Biden has virtue i wish the far right would be dealt harshly. Those far right ideologues are not idealists; they are in it for themselves only. Deal w/ them harshly and they vanish away.

[Matthew Strongin]

These guys won´t quiet down; they are probably hoping for more cash to maintain their vitriol. As much as a tolerant stance from Biden has virtue i wish the far right would be dealt harshly. Those far right ideologues are not idealists; they are in it for themselves only. Deal w/ them harshly and they vanish away.

I watched about 5 minutes of Candace Owens being interviewed by Lou Dobbs on Fox Business last night and despite having incredibly low expectations for either of these individuals or the Fox Business (Fox News) platform, I was flabbergasted and enraged. I'm starting to have a hard time balancing my fervent belief in freedom of speech with how it is being abused to do such harm. My favorite part was where Candace Owens compared a future Biden presidency to the Soviet Union under Stalin's rule. Absolutely absurd, but quite effective fear mongering for the hordes of people susceptible to such nonsense.

[colker]

I'm starting to have a hard time balancing my fervent belief in freedom of speech with how it is being abused to do such harm. My favorite part was where Candace Owens compared a future Biden presidency to the Soviet Union under Stalin's rule. Absolutely absurd, but quite effective fear mongering for the hordes of people susceptible to such nonsense.

It´s the current way to destroy democracy; they do it from the inside by either abusing fredom of speech or demoralysing institutions when in charge. There is a couple good books, People against democracy by Yasha Mounk and How democracy dies by Steve Levitsky, on this new breed of populist fascism: how it engages in destroying liberal conservativism untill all we have is extreme right and left, both sides of the same authoritarian coin. There is no dialogue w/ these people: you either shut them down or they kill democracy. Bannon has already been dealt with.

[GrantM]

Where do i send my contribution to the Trump Presidential library?

-g

stolen.jpg

[guido]

[echappist]

I watched about 5 minutes of Candace Owens being interviewed by Lou Dobbs on Fox Business last night and despite having incredibly low expectations for either of these individuals or the Fox Business (Fox News) platform, I was flabbergasted and enraged. I'm starting to have a hard time balancing my fervent belief in freedom of speech with how it is being abused to do such harm. My favorite part was where Candace Owens compared a future Biden presidency to the Soviet Union under Stalin's rule. Absolutely absurd, but quite effective fear mongering for the hordes of people susceptible to such nonsense.

It is really sad, but this is basically a manifestation of Paradox of Tolerance.

For a long time, we have taken freedom of speech as an alloyed good (I'm referring to freedom of speech in general, and not just freedom from repercussion from various levels of government), but it's perhaps a time for a rethink.

Years ago, while I was a student at Columbia, the president of the university invited Mahmoud Ahmadinejad to speak on campus, and this was after Ahmadinejad had already uttered some truly horrendous anti-Semitic drivel, including denial of the Holocaust. The Columbia president's way of countering this was to give a monologue lecturing Ahmadinejad re: respect for civil traditions, which at once seemed ineffective and overbearing. Fortunately, Ahmadinejad at least had the awareness not to offend his host by spewing his usual anti-Semitic drivel during his speech, but one really wonders what was accomplished by all that. There was a verbal exchange, alright, but no dialogue that improved the situation. It certainly appeared to me as nothing more than intellectual onanism on the part of Columbia's president...

Also, just to think, it has taken four debates before the debate commission realized it may be important to give the moderator a muzzle option to prevent the incumbent from interrupting. It also has taken five years for the networks to realize that when all the incumbent has to say are lies and more lies, it's okay to call him out on it and cut away from the coverage. Neither is depriving the incumbent his freedom of speech.

[BBB]

Loses election, chucks toys out the toy box, plays golf two days running (where he apparently cheats) and the US records record levels of Covid cases for several days on end. And this is the person about 70m people voted for?

[jclay]

What Trump's four years taught me about the two White Americas

Analysis by John Blake, CNN

'Many scoffed when President Trump declared that he's done more for Black people than any president since Abraham Lincoln. But as I contemplate the end of Trump's presidency, I realize that he has set millions of Black Americans free in at least one disturbing way:

He has freed us of any illusions we may have had about a certain segment of White America.
Even though Joe Biden won this election, Black America has lost some measure of hope. It was heartening to see so many White people dancing in the streets Saturday after Biden's victory was announced. But the fact that a president who is widely viewed as a racist can still command so many White votes -- after also playing down a pandemic that has killed at least 234,000 Americans -- is chilling. . .

Trump's presidency was a super-spreader event for racism. But I wonder if much of White America has built such a tolerance for racism that they see no need for change. . .

The hardest lesson of all

I once thought that the US was on a glide path to the kind of country that the Rev. Martin Luther King Jr. evoked in his "I Have a Dream" speech. Sure, there were going to be bumps and bruises, but we would get there. We were on our way to becoming the compassionate, multireligious, multiracial democracy that the late historian Vincent Harding loved to evoke. . .

Now I'm starting to lose my faith in democracy itself. Maybe people are too tribal to build a genuine multiracial and multireligious democracy. Maybe Greek philosophers like Socrates were right when they said that democracies were too inherently unstable because people couldn't be trusted to pick wise leaders.

Maybe millions of White Americans will never accept me as an equal, no matter what I or others like me do.
I'm thankful for the many White Americans who risked their lives to stand with Black protesters and other people of color this year.

But I now know that millions of White Americans remain MAGA all the way, even though Trump lost. Some of them even took to the streets this week to claim the election was stolen.

Trump may be defeated, but Trumpism and its brand of White racial grievance are here to stay.

That's been the hardest lesson of all.'

https://www.cnn.com/2020/11/08/polit...ake/index.html

[ides1056]

[Too Tall]

Hey John C. Keep the faith baby. The feckless one is done, we have many good possibilities. Let's ride bikes and keep talking. I'm in the way so I'll just send $$ and call BS where I see it. That's my lot pal, bet you can do more than me.

[pdmtong]

big day yesterday...

Van Winkle 15 (wanted the power of the 15, not the nuance of the 20/23) followed by Brora 30
d14d865b51e9d6691bb5b2e33f71d26b.jpg

Madam Vice-President..."immigrants, we get the job done"

[j44ke]

If McConnell et al were truly done with Trump, they would speak up and tell him he lost and should concede. Trump didn’t steal conservatism. To borrow his earlier infamously disgusting statement, he walked up to the Republicans and grabbed them by the ______. And they didn’t say a thing. Nothing was stolen. They went with him willingly, hand in hand.

As far as conservatism, that’s as meaningless a word as socialism in this country.

[Too Tall]

big day yesterday...

Van Winkle 15 (wanted the power of the 15, not the nuance of the 20/23) followed by Brora 30
d14d865b51e9d6691bb5b2e33f71d26b.jpg

Madam Vice-President..."immigrants, we get the job done"

Oh helllsyes. I've got a bottle squirreled away and completely forgot about it. NOT TOO LATE!

[colker]

If McConnell et al were truly done with Trump, they would speak up and tell him he lost and should concede. Trump didn’t steal conservatism. To borrow his earlier infamously disgusting statement, he walked up to the Republicans and grabbed them by the ______. And they didn’t say a thing. Nothing was stolen. They went with him willingly, hand in hand.

As far as conservatism, that’s as meaningless a word as socialism in this country.

There is more to conservatism than the Republican Party in the USA in 2016/20.
As an ideology or set of political principles, conservatism is fundamental right now as it opposes the various populisms walking over constitutions everywhere from Hungary to Russia and Venezuela where authoritarian governements suppress civil constitutional rights. Conservatism is about preserving institutions and those who helped Trump implement his destruction and demoralization of liberal democracy are not conservatives... they are just right wing oportunists.

[j44ke]

There is more to conservatism than the Republican Party in the USA in 2016/20.
As an ideology or set of political principles, conservatism is fundamental right now as it opposes the various populisms walking over constitutions everywhere from Hungary to Russia and Venezuela where authoritarian governements suppress civil constitutional rights. Conservatism is about preserving institutions and those who helped Trump implement his destruction and demoralization of liberal democracy are not conservatives... they are just right wing oportunists.

I rest my case.

[j44ke]

And in other news...wtf?

[BBB]

As that presser was next to a sex shop, I'm surprised Rudy didn't have his hand down his pants. Again.

[Colinmclelland]

And in other news...wtf?

That was a classic. You could not make up shit this good. Neatly sums up the organisational ability

[Mark Kelly]

I think it reflects Twitter Ranting Unhinged Maga Pillock's inability to ever admit he was wrong.




Backronym is one of my favourite words.

[ABiCi]

It´s the current way to destroy democracy; they do it from the inside by either abusing fredom of speech or demoralysing institutions when in charge. There is a couple good books, People against democracy by Yasha Mounk and How democracy dies by Steve Levitsky, on this new breed of populist fascism: how it engages in destroying liberal conservativism untill all we have is extreme right and left, both sides of the same authoritarian coin. There is no dialogue w/ these people: you either shut them down or they kill democracy. Bannon has already been dealt with.

Unlimited tolerance must lead to the disappearance of tolerance. If we extend unlimited tolerance even to those who are intolerant, if we are not prepared to defend a tolerant society against the onslaught of the intolerant, then the tolerant will be destroyed, and tolerance with them.—In this formulation, I do not imply, for instance, that we should always suppress the utterance of intolerant philosophies; as long as we can counter them by rational argument and keep them in check by public opinion, suppression would certainly be most unwise. But we should claim the right to suppress them if necessary even by force; for it may easily turn out that they are not prepared to meet us on the level of rational argument, but begin by denouncing all argument; they may forbid their followers to listen to rational argument, because it is deceptive, and teach them to answer arguments by the use of their fists or pistols. We should therefore claim, in the name of tolerance, the right not to tolerate the intolerant.

Karl Popper, The Open Society and Its Enemies, 1945