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Thread: Minneapolis Social Injustice and Related

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    Default re: Minneapolis Social Injustice and Related

    What the news doesn’t show about protests in Minneapolis and Louisville - Vox

    "A pandemic has taken the lives of more than 100,000 Americans and put more than 30 million out of work, and to top it off, there has been an almost 30-day, caught-on-tape spree of police and vigilante violence against black people. For some, it may feel like the nation is on the brink of near-biblical levels of chaos.

    The responses across the nation, whether you call them riots (and you shouldn’t) or whether you call them protests, uprisings, unrest, or rebellions, are being covered by local and national news and social media. As a journalism professor who has studied and experienced media coverage of protests for years, I have watched repeatedly how poorly these events are conveyed by the media and understood by the public. Here’s what people watching the news must understand in order to get what’s truly going on, and keep your faith in America nominally intact in the process.

    First, it’s important to understand the mandate of the news, and that is to get eyeballs on the screen, whether that is your television screen or the one in your hands. Networks focus on spectacle: fires, people crying, and broken windows, instead of the larger story. In most cases (such as with the Ferguson, Missouri, and Baltimore, Maryland, protests a few years ago), property damage and fires are limited to a small area, and even during those times many people are just milling about, but shaking camera angles and tight shots want you to believe that every reporter is an extra in Saving Private Ryan and every protest looks like Kanye’s “No Church in the Wild” video.

    In reality, these protests are usually not completely consumed with chaos. Nighttime coverage will seldom show a full city map demonstrating that, two blocks over from a street that looks like a “city engulfed in flames,” there’s a CVS still open for business. The press flocking to dramatic images as a protest metaphor is not a new phenomenon.

    Further, much of the property damage attributed to protesters is often the result of police action or inaction in the face of lawful public behavior, something I’ve witnessed from Ferguson to the far-right protests in Charlottesville, Virginia. Tear gas canisters can still burn your hand hours after they’ve been launched by police, flares are thrown by riot response teams with reckless abandon, let alone live munitions and flash grenades.

    Sometimes buried at the end of post-protest reports by local authorities is the fact that police munitions often start fires at protests, but this is seldom reported by the press, and there have been surprisingly few protesters arrested for arson relative to the fires that erupted during the unrest. Which is more likely to set row houses ablaze, three teenagers in face masks with “No Justice, No Peace” signs or two smoldering tear gas shells sitting on a pile of dry leaves and newspaper for two hours?

    This is not to suggest that some protesters don’t cause violence or property damage, but observers, let alone journalists, should be making distinctions between the various actors that are actually on the scene during civil unrest. You have the aforementioned police who are armed. Then you have chaos agents and anarchists who infiltrate peaceful protests with their own agenda. This isn’t conspiracy theory; in Minneapolis alone, videos have emerged of strangely dressed people just engaging in wanton property destruction. No one knows who they are, but it seems unlikely that they are protesters.

    Then you have your run-of-the-mill opportunistic criminals. When the police are so occupied harassing and corralling peaceful protesters and the streets are filled with smoke, it’s pretty easy to break into a Verizon store, a beauty shop, or a grocery store and take what you want. These people are often conflated with actual revolutionaries, who are protesters that target actual structures and symbols of abuse and oppression. For protesters who are angry about violent, unaccountable police in Minneapolis, overtaking and burning down the Third Police Precinct is a specific act of revolt. This is a fundamentally different action than using the chaos from two blocks over to raid a liquor store.

    And, of course, none of these actors should be confused with the hundreds of men and women peacefully protesting who are usually subjected to violent reprisals by police. Which is why “they’re burning their own community” narratives are so misleading and dangerous. It’s irresponsible to not distinguish which “they” is being talked about.

    Which brings us to perhaps the most important thing to understand about how to watch protests: the context of what kind of protest garners police response. Over the past three months, the 24-hour cable networks have extensively covered mostly white armed men and women threatening police and politicians at state capitols across the nation over coronavirus lockdown policies.

    How often have you seen police in riot gear? In fact, police seldom use force or even present in force (protest shields, black helmets, etc.) when conservative or right-wing groups protest. When is the last time you saw a group of anti-abortion activists get tear-gassed? Yet left-leaning groups, and especially groups of minorities, their protests are often met with shows of force. Right-wing groups spit in the faces of police in regular gear in Michigan, while SWAT teams show up like Storm Troopers to chanting teens in Minneapolis. "
    Last edited by guido; 05-30-2020 at 07:35 AM.
    Guy Washburn

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    Default re: Minneapolis Social Injustice and Related

    Quote Originally Posted by nahtnoj View Post
    I personally DGAF if the citizenry of the Twin Cities sets fire to every police station and squad car they can find.
    Yup.

    This is what you get when you spend centuries fucking over a people. This is what you get when police get away with unwarranted killings. This is what you get when you don't work your ass off to rid police departments of violent, racist cops, and a culture of violence where using a firearm is normalized.

    You don't want to see this shit? Then do something about it.
    John Clay
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    Default re: Minneapolis Social Injustice and Related

    Xi Jinping must be pleased. Convenient to have riots in the US when you are planning to crush Hong Kong.
    Jorn Ake
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    Default re: Minneapolis Social Injustice and Related

    Autocrats everywhere love distraction.
    Guy Washburn

    Photography > www.guywashburn.com

    “Instructions for living a life: Pay attention. Be astonished. Tell about it.”
    – Mary Oliver

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    Default re: Minneapolis Social Injustice and Related

    What about the other three policemen?

    Are police officers that afraid of each other to let their colleague decide on life and death of a civilian without interposing ? Or is it that in a group of 4 policemen you are likely to find 4 racists out of them ?

    Is there a vsaloner who worked in the police force that could give us an insight in the culture in the US police forces ? Can you actually report a colleague or will your life becomes miserable ? Are some of them openly racists or white supremacists in and out of the office without any consequences ?
    Last edited by sk_tle; 05-30-2020 at 11:58 AM.
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    Default re: Minneapolis Social Injustice and Related

    The scale and scope of the fires last night can't be overstated. Gas stations and pharmacies all over town were burned. This is what the club where George Floyd and the cop worked together looked like this morning:




    There were hundreds of folks up and down Lake this morning sweeping glass and helping with cleanup. Lots of buildings still have open flame. I only managed to stay for about an hour because of the smoke. I feel like breathing it is becoming cumulative.

    There's now a very high number of UHauls near protest sites, and a seriously abnormal number of these trucks.





    Most were white, a few were black, and none had any other colors.

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    Default re: Minneapolis Social Injustice and Related

    @caleb, what do you think is up with the trucks? The two you showed have trailer hitches. Are the plates in state or out-of-state?
    Trod Harland, Pickle Expediter

    Not everything that is faced can be changed, but nothing can be changed until it is faced. — James Baldwin

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    Default re: Minneapolis Social Injustice and Related

    Quote Originally Posted by thollandpe View Post
    @caleb, what do you think is up with the trucks? The two you showed have trailer hitches. Are the plates in state or out-of-state?
    On a usual day, maybe even a usual week, I would see zero trucks like that in the neighborhood. It's not normal. Contractors in the city very rarely drive trucks like those, and they usually have insignia on the door so nobody calls the cops when they pull into the driveway of a mansion on River Road. None of them had any tools, or appeared to be engaged in any sort of work. They were mostly driving around pretty slowly.

    All Minnesota and Wisconsin plates so far, maybe one Florida. If they start rolling in from beyond I'll be very seriously worried.

    This is my fear: Far-Right Extremists Are Hoping to Turn the George Floyd Protests Into a New Civil War - VICE

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    Default re: Minneapolis Social Injustice and Related

    Quote Originally Posted by thollandpe View Post
    @caleb, what do you think is up with the trucks? The two you showed have trailer hitches. Are the plates in state or out-of-state?
    The gov and mayors are saying that up to 80% of the trouble is caused by people from out of state. They are using contact tracing technology used in the virus to analyze this(like the phone data that tracked the Florida beach goers when they left.) The St. Paul mayor said that everyone arrested in his city was from out of state.

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    Default re: Minneapolis Social Injustice and Related

    That is positively frightening. I hope more folks are taking pictures too, with tags if they can get them. And if they can get close enough to trucks without tags, then get the VIN.

    The trailer hitches, I’m wondering what they towed in or what they plan to use them for.
    Trod Harland, Pickle Expediter

    Not everything that is faced can be changed, but nothing can be changed until it is faced. — James Baldwin

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    Default re: Minneapolis Social Injustice and Related

    Quote Originally Posted by j44ke View Post
    Xi Jinping must be pleased. Convenient to have riots in the US when you are planning to crush Hong Kong.
    That was quick.

    https://www.washingtonpost.com/world...d6e_story.html

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    Default re: Minneapolis Social Injustice and Related

    Quote Originally Posted by Sbti View Post
    The gov and mayors are saying that up to 80% of the trouble is caused by people from out of state. They are using contact tracing technology used in the virus to analyze this(like the phone data that tracked the Florida beach goers when they left.) The St. Paul mayor said that everyone arrested in his city was from out of state.
    That doesn’t mean all the troublemakers are outsiders though. My brother lives in St. Paul and a few folks there decided to smash into the Walgreens about a block away from his house. His observation didn’t indicate one way or another, just that it occurred. But I’d speculate that most looters of this nature are local opportunists. And criminals. We can stand on soap boxes all day long and preach about societal ills and our nation’s original sins. But when anger becomes violent and burns down buildings and loots private businesses it’s crossed the line to common criminality.

    My buddy in Minneapolis whose house is at 38th and Nicollet fears his house will be burned, because threats of this nature have been made. He takes those threats as real, given the arson that has taken place.
    La Cheeserie!

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    Default re: Minneapolis Social Injustice and Related

    Quote Originally Posted by caleb View Post
    On a usual day, maybe even a usual week, I would see zero trucks like that in the neighborhood. It's not normal. Contractors in the city very rarely drive trucks like those, and they usually have insignia on the door so nobody calls the cops when they pull into the driveway of a mansion on River Road. None of them had any tools, or appeared to be engaged in any sort of work. They were mostly driving around pretty slowly.

    All Minnesota and Wisconsin plates so far, maybe one Florida. If they start rolling in from beyond I'll be very seriously worried.

    This is my fear: Far-Right Extremists Are Hoping to Turn the George Floyd Protests Into a New Civil War - VICE
    I’d be very suspicious of any story that would increase paranoia or ratchet up the tensions right now.

    Watch yourself, watch your neighborhood, take notes, take photos. But keep your head level.

    A lot of interested parties focusing their manipulative know-how on urban areas right now. Push out a story on right wing this and that, park a few trucks around the area. Suddenly things are a bit more tense.

    Also beware of the heighten significance of objects in a moment of heightened anxiety. Everyone’s radar is on 11 right now. A tree is not just a tree. A truck is not just a truck.

    And many things are different now. That store used to not be on fire. Now it is. That truck used to not be there. Now it is.

    Not saying things are not happening and people aren’t up to something. Just that destabilizing paranoia may be the goal. Stay cool.

    I do know that contractors show up pretty quickly in areas where a lot of damage has a occurred, either from natural disaster or a human one. Destruction means work. Unmarked trucks with no tools may be because they are not interested in drawing attention. Survey the scene, write up the estimates and go home.
    Last edited by j44ke; 05-30-2020 at 02:11 PM.

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    Default re: Minneapolis Social Injustice and Related

    Will Stancil’s feed matches what I see on the ground. He knows this city as well as anyone.

    Will Stancil (@whstancil) on Twitter

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    Default re: Minneapolis Social Injustice and Related

    Quote Originally Posted by sk_tle View Post
    Is there a vsaloner who worked in the police force that could give us an insight in the culture in the US police forces ? Can you actually report a colleague or will your life becomes miserable ? Are some of them openly racists or white supremacists in and out of the office without any consequences ?
    I am not a police officer but I have managed three cities in California and worked in six over the past thirty years. For the most part cops are good guys, but in any group of people you are going to have bad apples. The problem at least in California is how strong the unions are and how protected the officers are from discipline. It is so difficult to punish a police officer and firing one is next to impossible. The irony in California is how progressive and liberal we are in Sacramento when it comes to Legislating everything except when it comes to developing legislation that would make managing a police force easier.

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    Default re: Minneapolis Social Injustice and Related

    Quote Originally Posted by Arbolado View Post
    I am not a police officer but I have managed three cities in California and worked in six over the past thirty years. For the most part cops are good guys, but in any group of people you are going to have bad apples. The problem at least in California is how strong the unions are and how protected the officers are from discipline. It is so difficult to punish a police officer and firing one is next to impossible. The irony in California is how progressive and liberal we are in Sacramento when it comes to Legislating everything except when it comes to developing legislation that would make managing a police force easier.
    That’s not unique to California or even public unions. It’s a similar situation in many big cities, including Minneapolis. I’m a long time union member and for the most part what I’ve seen has been responsible union member representation and collective bargaining, but occasionally people who don’t deserve protection get it. Thankfully I’ve also seen the union do the right thing and represent a member as required but they haven’t always defended the indefensible. That’s what has happened too often with public unions and is what gives them a bad reputation.
    La Cheeserie!

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    Default re: Minneapolis Social Injustice and Related

    It is difficult when two liberal ideals come into opposition. The balance between workers rights and the rights of people not to be abused by those workers seems to be hard to make right now...
    Guy Washburn

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    Default re: Minneapolis Social Injustice and Related

    Quote Originally Posted by guido View Post
    It is difficult when two liberal ideals come into opposition. The balance between workers rights and the rights of people not to be abused by those workers seems to be hard to make right now...
    We usually know what’s right and wrong. Our internal moral compass is usually pretty strong and mine is off kilter by what happened to George Floyd and also by the violence I see on TV and hear reported by family and friends who are present in the Twin Cities. Both are abhorrent.

    I’d like to stay away from a label like liberal or conservative here, at least for me.
    Last edited by Saab2000; 05-30-2020 at 04:06 PM.
    La Cheeserie!

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    Default re: Minneapolis Social Injustice and Related

    Quote Originally Posted by Saab2000 View Post
    That’s not unique to California or even public unions. It’s a similar situation in many big cities, including Minneapolis. I’m a long time union member and for the most part what I’ve seen has been responsible union member representation and collective bargaining, but occasionally people who don’t deserve protection get it. Thankfully I’ve also seen the union do the right thing and represent a member as required but they haven’t always defended the indefensible. That’s what has happened too often with public unions and is what gives them a bad reputation.
    There are unions and then there are public safety unions, they are quite different in how they approach and work with management.

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    Default re: Minneapolis Social Injustice and Related

    ^Agreed. When I showed the beach city sworn officer compensation package ($219K) to a friend who works in mutual funds, his instant reply was "unions."

    As for homes being targeted in police brutality uprisings, that did not occur in 1992 LA. But friends who live across the street from Pershing Square where the protests began in LA last night received this from their management:

    protests.jpg

    The building was damaged but it has some retail on the ground level and is a converted 1930's office building.

    Qualified impunity - Why the prosecution of a Minneapolis police officer is such a rarity | United States | The Economist

    Why the prosecution of a Minneapolis police officer is such a rarity
    The doctrine of “qualified immunity” too often gives police miscreants a free pass


    If you have the stomach for the libertarian perspective. I do. Once a week.
    The Supreme Court Has a Chance To End Qualified Immunity and Prevent Cases Like George Floyd’s – Reason.com

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