Covid19

[vertical_doug]

Not published yet. They’re still conducting the analysis. I’ll ask her if/when it will be published and in what media.

Greg

Ask them to preprint on Medrxiv otherwise it is out of date before any review will be finish to publish

[jimcav]

Is this research published? Available to others working on reopening college campuses this fall?

there is stuff available pre-publish on medRxiv

Hopefully the previous magical thinking that saw the USA as a somehow be a different environment for the virus will end, and not repeat itself with schools. Other places have already gone through what happens, with much of the USA inexplicably deciding to ignore the lessons and see if it will be different (surprise, it isn't, except to show it is worse because we did less)

looking at current research; and the virus load circulating and personal habits/attitudes and lack of testing, it doesn't seem like a good idea yet
Shut and re-open: the role of schools in the spread of COVID-19 in Europe | medRxiv
COVID-19 screening strategies that permit the safe re-opening of college campuses | medRxiv

[htwoopup]

Another scary data point.

My step-daughter is an OT in Los Angeles. Yesterday, she just got assigned her first two patients to work on who had neurological issues due to having Covid.

Brain damage caused not by an accident in a car or on the job nor from a stroke...simply from having the virus and surviving.

[Chik]

Another scary data point.

My step-daughter is an OT in Los Angeles. Yesterday, she just got assigned her first two patients to work on who had neurological issues due to having Covid.

Brain damage caused not by an accident in a car or on the job nor from a stroke...simply from having the virus and surviving.

Ok, that's scary.

[claritycycler]

We get a vaccine and not everyone will take it, then what? Listening to NPR, a poll(don't know who/which) indicates 50% of the populace are now unwilling to take the vaccine when it's available, they want others to take it before they do, lab rats so to speak, want to wait for general populace results to feel safe taking it. And these are not the usual anti-vaccers, for the most part they've taken vaccines all their lives but not willing this time. I've considered this possibility before but only in terms of the hardcore anti-vaccine group(no vaccines period). If and when a vaccine is produced and is available to all in a "timely manner"(not a given) there are still roadblocks to end this tragedy.

[gregl]

And these are not the usual anti-vaccers, for the most part they've taken vaccines all their lives but not willing this time.

Thanks to years of anti-vax conspiracy theories on the internet and a complete distrust of Government. I'm afraid that COVID19 will be part of our lives for years to come.

Greg

[davids]

We get a vaccine and not everyone will take it, then what? Listening to NPR, a poll(don't know who/which) indicates 50% of the populace are now unwilling to take the vaccine when it's available, they want others to take it before they do, lab rats so to speak, want to wait for general populace results to feel safe taking it. And these are not the usual anti-vaccers, for the most part they've taken vaccines all their lives but not willing this time. I've considered this possibility before but only in terms of the hardcore anti-vaccine group(no vaccines period). If and when a vaccine is produced and is available to all in a "timely manner"(not a given) there are still roadblocks to end this tragedy.

And their concerns are real. When the vaccine hits the street it will be the fastest ever developed, tested and deployed. It will be a spectacular achievement but there is no way that we will know what small or latent side effects might not be manifest through the testing protocols.

There's going to be a more fraught risk calculation than usual. So while I'm not saying I won't get it, I will be second in line.

[caleb]

And their concerns are real. When the vaccine hits the street it will be the fastest ever developed, tested and deployed. It will be a spectacular achievement but there is no way that we will know what small or latent side effects might not be manifest through the testing protocols.

There's going to be a more fraught risk calculation than usual. So while I'm not saying I won't get it, I will be second in line.

There's been some good articles written lately about the Polio vaccine, a history we've been fortunately able to forget. I didn't realize that there were known serious risks to the vaccine, but the world decided we should all accept those risks because not eradicating Polio would be so much worse.

Is Covid bad enough that we're willing to accept significant risk to be rid of it? I'm inclined to say "yes," but I don't think significant risk necessary means any and all risk. The hardest part might be making the decision about whether the vaccine risks are worth it before we know what those risks really are, and before we know how bad Covid really is.

[AngryScientist]

"you want it done right, or you want it done fast?"

[defspace]

Thanks to years of anti-vax conspiracy theories on the internet and a complete distrust of Government. I'm afraid that COVID19 will be part of our lives for years to come.

Greg

Projecting the transmission dynamics of SARS-CoV-2 through the postpandemic period | Science

[Too Tall]

We get a vaccine and not everyone will take it, then what? Listening to NPR, a poll(don't know who/which) indicates 50% of the populace are now unwilling to take the vaccine when it's available, they want others to take it before they do, lab rats so to speak, want to wait for general populace results to feel safe taking it. And these are not the usual anti-vaccers, for the most part they've taken vaccines all their lives but not willing this time. I've considered this possibility before but only in terms of the hardcore anti-vaccine group(no vaccines period). If and when a vaccine is produced and is available to all in a "timely manner"(not a given) there are still roadblocks to end this tragedy.

Terms of employment.
Mutually agreed conditions for return to work.
Required immunizations for enrollment in xxxxx

[vertical_doug]

Terms of employment.
Mutually agreed conditions for return to work.
Required immunizations for enrollment in xxxxx

I think you are all jumping the gun. Whether we get a vaccine or not, is a good problem to have. The head of vaccine research at the Mayo Clinic, head of Pfizer, etc are all discussing the probable necessity of two shots for some form of immunity. This can only delay development and approval. Considering the re-opening of schools and Winter will come first, with everyone inside, we will have much bigger problems than worrying about anti-vaxxers. I think society lights itself on fire before we get a vaccine. (actually, we just start shooting each other like the Hatfields and McCoys.)

The honeymoon of remote working is ending, and as companies realize they do not need as many middle management, support, tech and other employees, the next round of permanent layoffs is starting.
( I am always this cheerful on Friday )

[bcm119]

.....

The honeymoon of remote working is ending, and as companies realize they do not need as many middle management, support, tech and other employees, the next round of permanent layoffs is starting.
( I am always this cheerful on Friday )

That's a very interesting observation/prediction and I think you're right, at least about middle management. The office workplace has always favored people who like to hear themselves talk, and the pandemic has exposed the fact that [mostly male] overconfidence has been overvalued all along.

[Todd Amunrud]

There's been some good articles written lately about the Polio vaccine, a history we've been fortunately able to forget. I didn't realize that there were known serious risks to the vaccine, but the world decided we should all accept those risks because not eradicating Polio would be so much worse.

Is Covid bad enough that we're willing to accept significant risk to be rid of it? I'm inclined to say "yes," but I don't think significant risk necessary means any and all risk. The hardest part might be making the decision about whether the vaccine risks are worth it before we know what those risks really are, and before we know how bad Covid really is.

My dad describes receiving the polio vaccine around age 10. He says they lined the kids up in the gym, wheeled in an iron lung, and asked them to drink the small paper cup(oral polio vaccine), or plan to live in the machine sometime. Kids just followed the line to the cups.

[SeanEasley]

And their concerns are real. When the vaccine hits the street it will be the fastest ever developed, tested and deployed. It will be a spectacular achievement but there is no way that we will know what small or latent side effects might not be manifest through the testing protocols.

There's going to be a more fraught risk calculation than usual. So while I'm not saying I won't get it, I will be second in line.

This is where the military will come in...the active duty troops won't have a choice, just like I didn't to have many things stuck in me during my 24 years of active duty. Especially before deployments; smallpox, anthrax vaccines, malaria prophylaxis for 6 months straight. You can wait and see what happens with them before you take it.

Speaking of the mention of brain damage in some cases, were they more specific? Like did it come from strokes? I've been reading more about how small blood clots all over the body is one of the major issues for a lot of people infected. All the more reason to get on that baby aspirin regimen that is normally a good idea anyhow. I've been on it for several months now. Might be good insurance for this thing if you get it.

[Mark Kelly]

Speaking of the mention of brain damage in some cases, were they more specific?

My son's partner's brother, currently working on the frontlines in an ICU in California, says anything that reduces oxygen supply to the brain will cause damage so he's not surprised by the damage seen in recovered COVID-19 patients.

[htwoopup]

My step-daughter said both patients were only due to effects of Covid. One of the patients is 29. Neither had any underlying condition. She has another two patients that have recovered from Covid but were her patients before they had the virus. These two new ones were totally a result of Covid. Were released by the hospital with proviso for OT care due to what she (after giving me the medical description) put into layman’s terms as being the same as if they had had a stroke...problems with movement of limbs etc. I don’t know the more specific cause of the brain damage the particular patients (she shys away from going into too much detail when talking about work as she doesn’t want to violate privacy) in Samantha’s care suffered in the sense of how the Covid did it so I will leave that to more informed folks.

[guido]

Take Coronavirus More Seriously, Say Olympic Rowers Who Got It - The New York Times

"A physical therapist brought the virus to rowers who were training to make the U.S. Olympic team, and one gold medalist said it “knocked us down pretty hard.”

The women on the United States national rowing team think that young, healthy people need to take the coronavirus more seriously. They learned that the hard way.

More than one-third of the team was infected with Covid-19, the disease caused by the virus, in March and April, during the initial swell of the virus in New Jersey, according to Dr. Peter Wenger, the team doctor for its training center in Princeton, N.J.

At least 12 women had the virus, he said, based on various test results of athletes and observations he had made of rowers who were not tested but showed symptoms of infection. During that first wave of infections, testing wasn’t yet widely available.

In late March, several days after New Jersey instituted a stay-at-home order as the coronavirus began to ravage parts of the state, Marc Nowak, the team’s physical therapist, tested positive for the virus after experiencing minor cold-like symptoms and promptly reporting them to U.S. Rowing.

In the previous two weeks, Nowak said, he had come into direct contact with “pretty much the whole team” of 33 women during 30-minute physical therapy sessions of hands-on stretching and muscle and joint manipulation. Out of caution — and fortunately for the team — Wenger used one of his office’s limited coronavirus tests to check on his colleague.

One by one, starting four or five days after exposure, rowers began to show symptoms of infection.

“In that first wave of things happening, everything was really sketchy and there weren’t really directives about wearing masks,” said Nowak, who has worked with the national team for 18 years. “We just didn’t have the information we needed to take the right precautions.”

Nowak said his wife, who is an operating room nurse, and two adult children living with them also contracted the virus, though his daughter did not become ill and later tested positive for antibodies.

“Now the message is, learn from us and what we’ve gone through,” Nowak said.

Emily Regan, an Olympic gold medalist from Williamsville, N.Y., who was among those infected, wrote a post on Facebook this month highlighting how debilitating the disease could be, even for some of the world’s best athletes who have incredibly powerful and efficient lungs. Most women at the training center are vying to make the eight-oared boat for the Tokyo Games next summer, when the United States will try to win its fourth straight gold medal in that marquee event.

“The narrative that has been going around in some places is that you won’t get the virus if you’re young and strong, or if you get it, it won’t be bad, but we’re perfect examples of how that is totally not true,” Regan said. She added: “Look what the virus still did to us. It knocked us down pretty hard.”

The rowers infected ranged in age from 23 to 37, Regan said, and many battled symptoms for weeks. The cases were categorized as mild, though some athletes dealt with complications for as many as 40 days, according to Wenger. None of the rowers required hospitalization, he said."

[Too Tall]

Thanks Guido for that. FWIIW I've shutdown my Massage Therapy practice. I'd briefly considered restarting with some requirements such as recent testing yada yada and come to reality none of this is entirely responsible. My long time clients are suffering or taking chances going to therapists who choose to work IMHFO. That tugs at my heart but reality is a mutha. I've got a choice, some have less or none.

[ides1056]

I was tested a week ago by my doctor- no results yet, but I would not want to be on the front lines of testing because without an external air source and a helmet on I don't see how a person could avoid being exposed. I have good breath control and found the swab very invasive: my eyes watered and nose ran, and stifling a cough was very hard. I also had an antibody test- blood drawn- and a tick panel for good measure.