We have officially become inured to mass shootings.

[rwsaunders]

I received a link to this video this morning from Ohio State, where my youngest is a sophomore...titled RUN, HIDE, FIGHT. Essentially, a somewhat disturbing video about what to do when an active shooter is on campus, as narrated by a campus policewoman. I watched the video as unfortunately, it involves a subject which is too close to home...young people and schools. Note that the City of Houston actually trademarked the process. If you have a kid in school, I'd recommend that you watch the video for the simple reason that this is life as we know it right now.

this videohttps://dps.osu.edu/active-aggressor

[ides1056]

Black Panthers were most likely prohibited possessors (felony) especially if they somehow converted AR15 to full-auto (felony).[/QUOTE]

I don't know what the laws were in 1967. But my point was in part how different the world was then. We used to keep guns on racks in the back window of the pickup truck, and could drive across the GG Bridge and shoot in what is now the Golden Gate Recreation area. I was hiking there last week and wondered where it was we had done this. Wolfback Ridge was the name of the place.

I was visiting a person a few years ago in Portland, OR, and he pulled a full auto Tech 9 with a silencer and banana clip from under his bed. Bigtime felony. I said nothing. My high school room mate showed up to a reunion with a Chrome Python in a case, just the biggest hand cannon a person can buy. He insists on traveling with it. Gives me the willies. Back in the day I would not have cared.

What has changed in our country? I see profound social ills abounding. Mass shootings are one of many that aren't sufficiently addressed by our government, sadly.

One last thing: I will cop to being elitist as f***. But the mason I work with whenever there's a need is a big time competitive skeet shooter and he has a Perazzi. He could not be more working class, but it's the tool for the job as far as he is concerned. The Beretta is a fantastic game gun, never skipping a beat. I agree. Remington 3200 was the top of the list when I still shot skeet. Don't know why they stopped making them.

[mzilliox]

Matt - i respect what you state above and generally agree that we can't simply have / use whatever we want without some justification of need and purpose. rather, i tried to counter what i see as the primary, or even the sole reason to ban semi-auto's - the NEED of the thing - by most non-gun folks, and to highlight other areas, simplistic though they may be, that could come into question. without trying to sound flip...even though cars are "heavily regulated with licensing, testing, registration, oversight, monitoring (highway patrolling), insurance, etc.", they are also still heavily abused, and by folks with complete and total disregard for human life, both theirs and others. and i would in no way, shape or form be in agreement with banning supercars, high - HP SUV's, muscle-cars, etc. i accept the risk of cars as part-and-parcel of having them in our society.

i personally feel the gun debate would be better served to move away from one side forcing the other to define need, and to focus on how best to keep them out of the hands of criminals via UBC, safety/storage against theft, registration, licensing, etc. most of which i'm ok with.

i think KOD hit the nail on the head in terms of how both sides are closer in agreement that we think we are - but the HOW of the details to implement gun control are the sticking points. i agree with most suggestions throughout this thread, with the exception of an all out ban on semi-auto-'s and high capacity mags, for example.

HR. Eight comes to mind [was in the House last Feb, if i recall correctly]. as i type this i will state up front that my details may not be % accurate....but in a nutshell, many republicans were onboard with UBC and as part of that when convicted felons attempted to purchase firearms and were caught out, then the FFL would be required to notify law enforcement and provide the details [great idea, btw]. R's put in a last minute amendment to include illegal aliens in this process and a notification to ICE - D's went ballistic over this. to be clear - i make no statement here regarding immigration, but rather that a deal seems so close, yet so far in terms of execution. the "all or nothing" philosophy from both sides is the real barrier here, IMO.

why do you disagree with a ban of high capacity magazines?

[djg714]

Another one....8/31/19 Texas again.

[joosttx]

Another one....8/31/19 Texas again.

I just dont see the arguement for arming our citzens with semi-automatic weapons will stop bad guys from killing the innocent.

[thollandpe]

Everybody look what’s going down.

Another angry white man. Another AR-pattern rifle.

[Dallas Tex]

Another angry white man......

And the color of his skin matters......why ?

[colker]

And the color of his skin matters......why ?

It´s another cliche just like immigrant, inner city, drug addict, wall street, feminist, priest... We can´t think outside of those boxes.

[thollandpe]

And the color of his skin matters......why ?

It matters because, at a time when our nation is considering, or has enacted, policies that regard the threat from crime perpetrated by immigrants as the most urgent, and/or are willing to label an entire religion as our most serous threat, and that a few young — and female and non-white and democratically-elected — representetatives are our biggest threat, we continue to soft pedal on the threat of domestic terrorism.

And these domestic, home-grown terrorists are mostly white young men who mostly obtained their simply ridiculous armories through legal means.

I’d like to see sensible, reasonable, socially-conscious people stop defending the means that they continue to use in order to stockpile those armories. And kill scores on people on a frighteningly regular basis.

[thollandpe]

It´s another cliche...

Look at what’s happened. Look at the shooters like you’re a detective. As if you’re trying to prevent the next attack. Figure it out.

[Dallas Tex]

It´s another cliche just like immigrant, inner city, drug addict, wall street, feminist, priest... We can´t think outside of those boxes.

None of these things are an immutable characteristic like skin color.

[bigbill]

Look at what’s happened. Look at the shooters like you’re a detective. As if you’re trying to prevent the next attack. Figure it out.

The interview with the shooter's neighbor is kind of spooky. He lived in a shack with no water or electricity and in the cold months would sit in his running car to keep warm. He frequently shot at animals in his yard and he threatened the neighbor with a rifle. The police were called but never responded because the rural address isn't on GPS. That describes about half of Kingman, AZ.

I would hope the FBI has root cause experts piecing together to find patterns and a path forward. So many guns are already out there, not sure what new laws would do about that. I have two handguns, a semiautomatic and a revolver. They're both registered in my name. I have two rifles that aren't because of when I purchased them. Other than invading privacy, how would a gun law prohibiting large magazines or semiautomatics be enforced? We can ban future sales, but again, so many already out there. The Odessa shooter, from what I've read, had misdemenor charges but no felonies. He could own a gun and pass a background check. I think if the police had responded when the neighbor called, the story might have been different. Same for the Texas church shooter a while back, if the Air Force had correctly informed of that person's conditions of discharge, he would have failed a background check.

[Dallas Tex]

Look at what’s happened. Look at the shooters like you’re a detective. As if you’re trying to prevent the next attack. Figure it out.

Figure out what? That you think skin color has something to do with this horrific event ? In a country where 72% has the same skin color? 237 Million suspects fit the description?

[thollandpe]

Figure out what? That you think skin color has something to do with this horrific event?

That’s my point. Not skin color (unless it’s white), not religion (unless it’s Christian), not immigration status, and not even the mental health canard.

Jill, we’ve traced the call and it’s coming from inside the house.

We have to solve this problem. And all the conventional approaches seem to be looking in the wrong place. But one angle of questioning, one avenue that seems to hold some promise, the unfettered access to incredibly efficient weapons to kill fellow humans with, is being obstructed by a perverse and powerful political bloc.

Time to talk about the NRA in the past tense. Time to use the same tools we use to combat foreign terrorists against home-grown domestic terrorists.

Is anybody here philosophically against combating home-grown terrorists as aggressively as we combat other terrorists?

[Colinmclelland]

I'm sorry to keep saying i think it's weird how mainstream guns are over there. But..um it's weird to me.

I don't own a gun. I don't know anyone who owns a gun. If i decided i needed to own a gun I literally have no idea where i would go to try to get one. They are not a part of normal everyday life here. Sure, if i were into target shooting, i'm sure i'd know where. But i'm not and i don't.

I wouldn't be able to own a gun to keep in my bedside table because there's a law against that. I would be able to go target shooting at the club, because those two things aren't mutually exclusive.

I reckon if you accept guns as mainstream, you are kind of accepting gun violence as mainstream.

The US approach to gun control legislation seems eerily similar to Australia's energy and climate change policy. Do nothing, pretend nothing is wrong. As a spoiler, our energy "policy" is not working out so well. We have pulled off the challenging combination of having the highest per capita CO2 emissions AND having the highest cost energy!

Personally i think you need to stop trying to come up with the right answer before you do anything. Just do something. It'll be wrong but you can fix that once you've started...

[theflashunc]

Figure out what? That you think skin color has something to do with this horrific event ? In a country where 72% has the same skin color? 237 Million suspects fit the description?

Or...this country has a serious problem with white nationalist and supremacist spree killings. Like the Poway and Pittsburgh synagogue shootings. The El Paso shooting. The Gilroy Garlic Festival shooting. And those are all just in the last 12 months.

TBD what the motive is for this latest shooting, but if they're pulling materials from an off-the-grid shack the guy used, I wouldn't be floored if the guy also ascribed to white nationalist views.

[holliscx]

NYT commenter nailed it referencing The Onion headline:

‘No Way To Prevent This,’ Says Only Nation Where This Regularly Happens

[Dallas Tex]

That’s my point. Not skin color (unless it’s white), not religion (unless it’s Christian), not immigration status, and not even the mental health canard.

“That’s my point”......... I guess I missed it, please clarify your point.

[joosttx]

“That’s my point”......... I guess I missed it, please clarify your point.

I have a ranch near Odessa, Tx. Everyone has a gun there. If no citizen could not stopped this dude, how is arming citizens an effective way of preventing this sort of thing from happening?

[Dallas Tex]

I have a ranch near Odessa, Tx. Everyone has a gun there. If no citizen could not stopped this dude, how is arming citizens an effective way of preventing this sort of thing from happening?

I don’t believe that I said it would be.