Ventless (condensation) electric dryers from Bosch, Miele, etc.

[sbornia]

Following on Saab2000's epic thread about washers and dryers, I wanted to hear about anyone's experience with ventless/condensation electric dryers.

The house we just bought has a very small laundry enclosure in the kitchen. While it has an older 27" washer and gas dryer now, if we ever have to replace those units, their modern counterparts will be too big to fit without modifying the cabinetry extensively (appliances have apparently grown taller and deeper in the last decade). In contrast, 24" stacking models from Bosch and other companies will fit the space easily. I would need to have a 220v line installed. But I am a little apprehensive about the ventless dryers due to the extra time they need, though as I understand it they are the norm in Europe and elsewhere.

Those of you with this type of dryer (Jorn? NYCFixie?) -- how do they work for you?

Thanks!

[bigbill]

They were the norm in Italy but we used an old gas dryer on the covered patio with a bomba (butane bottle) hooked up. Towels, jeans, and socks would take hours to dry in the ventless dryer. In the gas dryer, towels were about 30 minutes plus it used less electricity because the heat was gas.

[Matthew J]

Those of you with this type of dryer (Jorn? NYCFixie?) -- how do they work for you?

I had the earlier version of this all in one LG washer dryer. I used an in-home drying stand for heavier cotton items rather than living it go for a long period of time. Cycling clothes, etc. dried well fairly quickly.

Seemed to me my clothes and linens held up longer - less fraying, etc. - with the LG than previous US standard washer dryer combos.

[echelon_john]

Bloomberg makes a 24" vented stackable option.

Blomberg DV17542 24 Inch Electric Dryer with Sensor Drying, ENERGY STAR, Clean Filter Light, 16 Cycles and 3.67 cu. ft. Stainless Steel Drum

[11.4]

Had an LG ventless setup about five years ago. I had a few hassles with the dryer. First, it didn't dry particularly well -- you inevitably had a slight dampness left and had to hang clothing on hangers or a wooden rack overnight so everything dried properly. It was a better way to dry without wrinkles and without wear on the fabrics, but it was still a pain. Second, you have to drain a container from time to time. It always seemed to overflow and always seemed to grow mold. I'd had it professionally installed, but I couldn't say the result was that good. Third, the heat didn't really get to vent anywhere so it created a fair bit of warmth.

If I compared it to your basic vintage Whirlpool or GE units, which tended to bake your clothes and left lint everywhere, it was marginally better. But there are so many better washers and dryers today and most are made for very tight installations. I currently have a couple LG dryers (yes, a couple -- don't ask) and they mount in spaces where I didn't think they would fit. I had the ventless units in a space where the back wall was shared with a hallway, so there wasn't much I could do to plumb it. If you have any options at all, I think you can do better. There are pancake vents that are like 2x10 inches and the LGs I have now both have adapter kits so they can vent down, up, or in any directly sideways. Put the dryer on top and you can run a vent just about anywhere, or put it on the bottom and run the vent right through the floor.

[spopepro]

I *just* got the new LG signature combo washer/dryer that uses a heat pump system. It actually works. The unit is really nice. It's super gentle on clothes, uses almost no energy, and will take and dry a pretty big load. Only requires 120v.

But...

If you have pets, be aware-- we have to do a little drain and clean routine for the plastic pump filter *every* load. It will clog with cat fur and fail to drain if we don't. Granted, we have very, very furry fuzzballs, but it's the only downside we have run into (and potentially a big one)

Oh, and the price. Yeah... it's expensive. But we still like it. I think they make some standalone dryers with the heat pump, but you might have to dig through the documentation to see what system the unit uses. I've never been happy with straight "condensation" dryers.

[sbornia]

Thanks all, some helpful info here. I'll look more into the heat pump dryers, as those seem to be in small (24") packages that won't require us to modify the nice cherry cabinet and also allow us to continue using the pocket doors as designed. OTOH if we sacrifice some of the cabinet's functionality, say by relocating a shelf and keeping the doors open all the time, we could get standard 27" appliances and use the existing gas line and vent.

unnamed.jpg

[NYCfixie]

we have one in our rental. it sucks. it barely dries anything.

[j44ke]

Thanks all, some helpful info here. I'll look more into the heat pump dryers, as those seem to be in small (24") packages that won't require us to modify the nice cherry cabinet and also allow us to continue using the pocket doors as designed. OTOH if we sacrifice some of the cabinet's functionality, say by relocating a shelf and keeping the doors open all the time, we could get standard 27" appliances and use the existing gas line and vent.

unnamed.jpg

What is above this cabinet? Is there another floor? Which way do the joists go and is that direction close to an exterior wall? If there is just an attic or a crawl space, just run the vent up into that space. You can in some instances vent the dryer directly into the space as long as you have pretty good moisture management, i.e. live in a relatively warm dry environment. If the joists above run towards a nearby exterior wall, a talented installer can snake the dryer vent hose between the joists and out. You don't need a lot of space for the vent, and if you put in a 220 line you'll need to be creative with snaking wire anyway.

Ventless condensation dryers would not be my choice where there is a lot of wood, especially nice nice wood like your cabinets. Way too much moisture. With the Bosch stackable units, you will be washing smaller loads to prevent major wrinkling and reasonable drying times. This is not a defect, just a product of their size. We drop off sheets, duvet covers and towels at the cleaners. The Bosch 24" dryer just can't do it efficiently, though it can do it eventually. In a pinch, we give it a shot with the Bosch and hang it up to dry the rest of the way, albeit with plenty of wrinkles (if that matters to you.) If you like the service you are getting from the gas dryer, I'd keep it and replace it with the same or similar.

Our friends in Switzerland have a drying room in their apartment building. At one end of the room is a giant fan, and from the fan to the other end of the room are strung long laundry lines. Somewhere there is a slightly anemic heating element. You bring your wet close into the room, hang them up and 5 or 6 days (okay, I exaggerate - maybe only 1 or 2) later, everything is dry. Not the best in Swiss technology.

[SteveP]

not sure the relevance here but every dryer i have ever tried to use in Europe barely works.

takes hours, clothes stay damp.

[Saab2000]

not sure the relevance here but every dryer i have ever tried to use in Europe barely works.

takes hours, clothes stay damp.

My experience too. I hang dry most things and if there's a hurry I can blow a fan on it. I have a dryer and it gets used for sheets and other things too large to put on the drying rack.

[thollandpe]

Do not vent a regular dryer into the living space, regardless of how good your moisture management is. The particulates in lint are not healthy indoors. Bad risk.

[thollandpe]

Energy wise, you're paying for the energy to vaporize the water, and then to recondense it? Does not seem a wise choice, even if you're using both sides of the heat pump.

A gas dryer will cost less than half what an electric dryer costs to run, and it sounds like a condensing dryer will cost double. Or maybe just do half the job?

[j44ke]

My only experience with a gas dryer was disbelief. As in, I cannot believe everything is dry already. It was also a large dryer, which may have had something to do with it.

[xjoex]

I literally today just replaced old 24" machines with full size LG machines using a slim vent in the back for the dryer. My problem was max depth and these are 29.75" deep which has made me a very happy camper.
IMG_2635.JPG

-Joe

[sbornia]

I literally today just replaced old 24" machines with full size LG machines using a slim vent in the back for the dryer. My problem was max depth and these are 29.75" deep which has made me a very happy camper.
-Joe

Now *that* is super helpful! I can address our height issue by having a cabinet maker relocate a shelf that's in the way, but the very limited depth in the laundry area has been much harder to work around. Didn't realize there were slim ducts that only need half the clearance of regular ones. This may let me stick with a gas dryer. Thank you Joe!

[ides1056]

We've used an Asko condensing dryer in our NYC apartment for almost twenty years, two kids, one episode of lice which required everything to be washed, etc. No complaints.

But Todd is right about lint in general. We ran Hepa filters in every room to combat what leaked in the windows.

[Matthew J]

Whirlpool has been teasing release of a single unit washer dryer for a year now. Appears it will be available soon as photos are popping up on instagram.

Somewhat surprised to see a major North American player offering product with more apartment friendly dimensions. Imagine Whirlpool expects to sell more of these outside the US than in.

[Matthew J]

Energy wise, you're paying for the energy to vaporize the water, and then to recondense it? Does not seem a wise choice, even if you're using both sides of the heat pump.

A gas dryer will cost less than half what an electric dryer costs to run, and it sounds like a condensing dryer will cost double. Or maybe just do half the job?

Local electric carrier Commonwealth Edison has a service neighborhood household electric use. Using the LG I regularly was near the lowest electric users out of what ComEd says were 100 similarly sized units in my area of Chicago. I was an early adopter of LED lights, used an ultra-efficient ceiling fan rather than air conditioning, etc. But the LG certainly didn't bump my numbers.

[sbornia]

So many different perspectives on this...the other day, I had an home energy efficiency assessment done (required by the city when homes are purchased) and the inspector made no secret of his POV..."gas is dead" and "why pay PG&E for gas when you have free electrons over your roof?" Encouraged me to think holistically -- if we get solar panels at some point, electric appliances would ostensibly be "better".