Wade Patton Velo

[WadePatton]

For those who weren't here bitd this is a nearly real time chronicle of my time in Dallas last year-where I borrowed shop time from Glenn of Daltex, met some of the other Dallas area builders, went to their shops, and finally got the first one done. It's still a great bike. I have no plans to replace it any time soon. There will be a 650b mountain bike coming soon though.

http://www.velocipedesalon.com/forum...ture-7628.html

[ron l edmiston]

very meaningful response --- just what i knew yo'd b and r ...
"file over the lathe / mind over matter"

"ain't nothin like the real thing ---"

much respect,

ronnie

[mumbleypeg]

Thanks for honkin it out there Wade. Smoked out continues to inspire. I have days where smoked out posts are the best part. As Ronnie said, much respect.

[andys]

Great Smoked Out post man. Your "revelations" were revelations to me too when I read them and your autobiographical sharing was meaningful. You are definitely not alone in questioning the choice of your life's pursuit (I hate the word "career"). Thank you.

[kangarew99]

Hey Wade- Good on ya for making your own path. This might be a bit OT, but my son is Autistic and I'm always wondering how to help him make his own place in the world. Any words of advice of your own, or any advice you were given that really helped someone who's brain isn't wired like most? I figure if you're doing what you love then you've got some wisdom to share.
-Ryan

[WadePatton]

"ain't nothin like the real thing ---"
much respect, ronnie

thanks Ronnie, as the kids say these days, "keepin' it real".

Thanks for honkin it out there Wade. Smoked out continues to inspire. I have days where smoked out posts are the best part. As Ronnie said, much respect.

Thanks Mike, take inspiration anywhere you can get it. (I found mine in Colombian beans this morning, hand-ground and percolated.)

Great Smoked Out post man. Your "revelations" were revelations to me too when I read them and your autobiographical sharing was meaningful. You are definitely not alone in questioning the choice of your life's pursuit (I hate the word "career"). Thank you.

You're quite welcome Andy, I realized that many readers already knew a good bit about me, and that we naturally build a bit of "persona" around our online selves. I didn't want to play the same old song. I wanted to punch a hole in that and let folks know a little more about me whilst retaining some mystery and focusing on the future and where I'm going, not complaining about the past. Some one related this great quote to me once. "Let your past be a guide post, not a hitching post." unknown.

I'll always be a bit of an outsider as I don't have an lbs or industry lifer or even elite racer type background. I can deal with it.

Hey Wade- Good on ya for making your own path. This might be a bit OT, but my son is Autistic and I'm always wondering how to help him make his own place in the world. Any words of advice of your own, or any advice you were given that really helped someone who's brain isn't wired like most? I figure if you're doing what you love then you've got some wisdom to share.
-Ryan

Hey Ryan, thanks and that's an interesting question, but autism is something I know little about. Now and then I did think about working as a professional hunting/fishing guide or wildlife officer or racing car driver. But, respectively, I didn't want my profits to be related to the whims of the animals and weather, work for the state, and had zero interest in turning left all day long. Then I spent 14 years getting 7 years worth of degrees. (2 years were spent un-enrolled, and one full semester was dropped when I was hit by a truck). All that time with "gonna be a lawyer" hanging over me.

The closer time came to actually being one, the more I realized I didn't care to be. I kept hearing the words and wisdom of Dave Ramsey. Dave is a local guy who teaches folks nationwide the fallacies of owing money for things that go down in value. His main mission is debt elimination, but he has a very strong counseling nature and career development is part of that. He often references other great minds in that area. Dan Miller is one of those guys 48 Days. Dan Miller's program is bifurcated in that there is a path for those who will work for others (find a job) and also a method are those who will create their own work.

One of the simplest things these guys will say is, "What would you do if you didn't have to do anything?" Say maybe the Nigerian Prince comes through with his promises and you are mad rich. What do you do? And also, where are your talents, etc. Take some of those answers and find a way to make money with them. These guys have great stories of folks who volunteered to sweep floors or stack chairs just to get near an enterprise---where they eventually became leaders in those fields. IIRC, Col. Sanders was a late-bloomer.

I've veered off a little bit, but I think it's always a matter of focusing on the can do's , desires and talents rather than can'ts and "clock punching".

If not now, when?

Hope that helps someone.

[bellman]

Hey Wade, good stuff here, i'd ride the river with ya.

So as a newbie myself I find that learning how to build frames can be split up into a lot of parts. The main one of course is the actual manipulation of the material and tools but there is the other biggie which I will call 'theory', It has to do with the understanding of what makes a bike something more than a BSO (bike shaped object) . I myself have found that I have adopted a 'focus as the need arises' attitude towards a lot of these parts that make up the 'theory' end of the game. Lately for me it has been rake and trail. My question for you is, do you find yourself treating this the same way and where are you at with it, what are you working on, what have you conquered and what do you have coming up?
BTW, I'd like to see more of your stuff in the FNL!
thanks,
Jake

[dcpdpayne]

Hey there Wade,
I was a grand treat to meet you at NAHBS this year and hope to see you again soon. I always look forward to getting a call from the Wade Patton workshop to hear the latest buzz and keep up with your progress towards full time framebuild-ery. I admire that you've been very humble and honest about your start in the business (pre business) and I respect you for giving credit where credit is due to some good people like Rody,Tim, Richard, DW and the like. I guess that my question revolves around your connection with these guys.

With all the information that is out there on the internet, what about the human connection has been so important to assist you in your adventure? What types of things have you learned from other builders that you could have never learned by reading a "how to" guide?

[savine]

Looks like your in the right place, nothing holding you back just gotta go with the flow and follow your inner instinct. I´m likeing that.

[WadePatton]

Hey Wade, good stuff here, i'd ride the river with ya.

So as a newbie myself I find that learning how to build frames can be split up into a lot of parts. The main one of course is the actual manipulation of the material and tools but there is the other biggie which I will call 'theory', It has to do with the understanding of what makes a bike something more than a BSO (bike shaped object) . I myself have found that I have adopted a 'focus as the need arises' attitude towards a lot of these parts that make up the 'theory' end of the game. Lately for me it has been rake and trail. My question for you is, do you find yourself treating this the same way and where are you at with it, what are you working on, what have you conquered and what do you have coming up?
BTW, I'd like to see more of your stuff in the FNL!
thanks,
Jake

Hey Jake, thanks and in reverse order: Yes, I can put a lot of "non-framish, more 14x28 shoppish" stuff in FNL. I so dig seeing the processes mid-stream (and sponge up lots of info that way). "Laymen" might not understand, but some of us can see the through the work in hand to previous and upcoming processes. This in no way equates to proficiency in those things, but is sometimes a kick in a better direction. Thanks again to those who do show nice wide shots of how they do things both at FNL and in your blogs, etc.

"Conquered" is a mighty strong word! After 50 or 100 I might begin to think I've gotten a grip on filling an order and making the rider happy. I should begin to feel a little more comfortable wearing the framebuilders mantle by that point as well. Hmmm, I think I have _my_ position conquered. Getting that right for the next person is my biggest drama. I plan to do ride-with sizing sessions for my earliest customers. I'd be mighty uncomfortable trying to "remote" fit someone at this point. For me that's a big hurdle and a big deal that _has_ to be done right. Everyone has slightly different approaches to it, experts vary and even disagree, but it is a hallmark of this arena atmo. A good friend needs a tour/commuter-eventually. I'll study the finer points of that style of bike when he commissions the work.

I really dig shaping with the file*, getting that contour just right be it a lug or a fillet or cast piece of stainless with oh so much more toil (cue hard yakka video) to get it shiny. *a clean and sharp file that fits the work.

I've conquered walking around the NAHBS arena and meeting folks new and old--even intimidating ones. Three years of show-going helps.

Juggling the pipes around different wheel sizes was a recent "focus session". I landed squarely on 650b for the application (not built). Then more recently I struggled all night with a 'cross design. I like what I came up with. It's going together next but it may be a while before I get to hang components on it and really find out how I like it.

Again, I have the hyper/hypo focus situation, where "hypo" really means "multi".

Hitting a new canoe-only sized creek with some big fish in two weeks. paddle slap!

[WadePatton]

Hey there Wade,
I was a grand treat to meet you at NAHBS this year and hope to see you again soon. I always look forward to getting a call from the Wade Patton workshop to hear the latest buzz and keep up with your progress towards full time framebuild-ery. I admire that you've been very humble and honest about your start in the business (pre business) and I respect you for giving credit where credit is due to some good people like Rody,Tim, Richard, DW and the like. I guess that my question revolves around your connection with these guys.

With all the information that is out there on the internet, what about the human connection has been so important to assist you in your adventure? What types of things have you learned from other builders that you could have never learned by reading a "how to" guide?

Hey Andy, this has to be short as my caffeine level is dropping and there's a fresh pot over at my bro's shop (wood--arg!!!).

The first thing is learning who to listen to and who not to. Just like you can't know what goes into a frame until you build one, time in anothers shop during working hours reveals much more than words ever will. It leads to conversations that go beyond anything in a book or guide, maybe even classroom. The deeper the knowlegde gets, the more one sees the finer distinctions. Effbee's (i made that term up, cut and paste at will) can discuss things for two hours that a punter (to be Dazza-esque) would never think of or care about if he did. That's why he's a punter and we are builders. Doing is the dealio...I really like having a head full of reading as I gain experience. Nothing like finding the truest meaning of the words during the work.

Back later. As the the old farmer used to say when the day was slipping, "Swapping daylight for dark."

Cheers

edit: Hey, feel free to redirect me if I missed the point.

[Eddie]

Yo Wade,

You are more passionate about your socks than most anyone else I know. To me, that says a lot about you, and I dig it.

I believe your first build was a road bike, then a 650B SSHT, and now you speak of executing a 'cross rig and a tourer/commuter. As you've alluded above, you've got a ways to go to refine your skillset and define your brand image, and I look forward to watching that evolution. Also, as you and I have spoken of in the past, you have an obvious and apparent intellect that, when coupled with your folksy Tennessee mountain ways, makes for a tremendous read. I hope that you continue to fold your gift of writing into your frame building career for the rest of us to enjoy.

Alright, now for a question: You've spoken a bit above about the influence of guys such as Groovy Rody and Shamrock Tim, two guys with whom, in the short <2 years I've been involved in this interweb bike thing, I've had the good fortune of hanging with in person, using their product, and sharing a beer. Could you perhaps elaborate a bit more about your connection to these guys, how they came about, and the role they've played in your development as an framebuilder? I'm especially reaching for the story of the Shamrock nexus, as IIRC, there's a cool story there.

[WadePatton]

Looks like your in the right place, nothing holding you back just gotta go with the flow and follow your inner instinct. I´m likeing that.

Hello Savine, I firmly believe that a man (or woman: Margo, Natalie, Georgiana, et al) doing work he/she loves will produce superior work and that the passion and commitment is obvious in the product/service delivered.

That being said, it's a shame that small business itself is such a pain in the rump or we all might be able to play--and the whole of production might increase in value. That's the real trade-off. Do I love this enough to submit myself to the archaic rules and regulations of the state or should I punch a clock at the widget factory and let somebody else deal with that hassle? Widget making does not equal the business of widget making--you gotta be ready for both sides.

[conorb]

Great read Wade.

I remember getting together at the NAHBS show in PDX a couple of years ago. You mentioned that your Mom had bought you one of our t-shirts. I said 'Loretta?," and you were like totally stoked that I remembered her name.

I think you got it for your birthday or something.

It was great fun talking frames and framebuilding with you. I was impressed with your enthusiasm and general knowledge of all things two-wheeled. I am sure that you bring the same energy to your bikes.

Congrats on Wade Patton Velo, I can't wait to see what happens for you in the future.



Conor

[WadePatton]

Yo Wade, You are more passionate about your socks than most anyone else I know. To me, that says a lot about you, and I dig it.

If your feet ain't happy...

I believe your first build was a road bike, then a 650B SSHT, ... Also, as you and I have spoken of in the past, you have an obvious and apparent intellect that, when coupled with your folksy Tennessee mountain ways, makes for a tremendous read. I hope that you continue to fold your gift of writing into your frame building career for the rest of us to enjoy.

Thanks a bunch for mentioning that. I've really enjoyed exploring the personalities through the writings of some of the other builders and bike folks who write things beyond the confines of "normal biz". I have been collecting some of my thoughts in a folder for publication as part of my blog or site, whenever that happens. Right now I'm all V/S and FB. No time for other stuff. And no, I made a traditional wheeled ATB first, as I had all the parts for it. 650b has been drawn, but is on hold.

Alright, now for a question: You've spoken a bit above about the influence of guys such as Groovy Rody and Shamrock Tim... Could you perhaps elaborate a bit more about your connection to these guys, how they came about, and the role they've played in your development as an framebuilder? I'm especially reaching for the story of the Shamrock nexus, as IIRC, there's a cool story there.

I may have bumped into Rody at FF way back when, but I'm sure that I first met him at Portland NAHBS. Then last year, when I decided to go ahead and put pretty paint on the road bike, I called Rody. He basically said, "Sure, when can YOU come up here and HELP do it?" So we worked that out. It was fast-paced and intense and I learned a ton about paint, much of which will be helpful even if I never spray any.
Wade at Wooster
I also got to ride the "Knob" with Rody and John Upcraft (Hubcap), the only two frame builders I've ever ridden a bicycle with. I'm going to work on that.

At Indianapolis NAHBS, I was speaking with Suzanne Carlsen and Noah Rosen (Poka Cycle Accessories, VeloColour) across the aisle from (unbeknown to me) the Shamrock booth, when this booming voice (in stark contrast to Suzanne or Noah) comes from right behind me says "HEY, ARE YOU WADE PATTON?!" now I'm not flighty at all, but I didn't know whether to duck or say "sure bro". Well, I turned around without ducking and it was Tim. And that's just Tim. He "knew" me from my web presence. He invited me to his well-stocked booth where I met Griff (laser-guided) and we chatted between show-goers and I checked out all the cool bikes he brought and how he "touched" them with his hand.

The first two years I went to NAHBS I helped Glenn Thompson (Daltex) represent Dave Cheakas (Southwest Frameworks). When Dave/Glenn decided not to go to Richmond, I called Tim and immediately became part of his road crew., It's a pretty good gig. Ask Andy.

Rody and Tim, feel free to confirm or deny my statements, but remember--first in time! (oh wait, that's a law school reference.)

Howsat? I gotta get back out to the shop. The cordless drill has re-charged.

[WadePatton]

Great read Wade.

I remember getting together at the NAHBS show in PDX a couple of years ago. You mentioned that your Mom had bought you one of our t-shirts. I said 'Loretta?," and you were like totally stoked that I remembered her name.

I think you got it for your birthday or something.

It was great fun talking frames and framebuilding with you. I was impressed with your enthusiasm and general knowledge of all things two-wheeled. I am sure that you bring the same energy to your bikes.

Congrats on Wade Patton Velo, I can't wait to see what happens for you in the future.

Conor

Thanks so much Conor. I dig what you and Garrett do and love how you got started. Your photography is also top-damn-notch. Do you know how many times I had to shoot that shot you posted? When I think of polished ss, I think of Dazza first, then Conor Beuscher.

The personal interaction is that other great thing we have to offer atwo. Whether you remembered my mom's name because you put "Patton" and "Tennessee" together, or because selling a single t-shirt to someone you've never talked to is just odd, or because it's also Carl's wife's name makes no difference to me. It was cool. It's part of the personal interaction that is part of the package "we" provide to our customers. I value that as a customer, and darn sure want to give it as a builder.

Your T-shirt was one of the first in my collection. Hmm, there's also Coconino, Hubcap, Groovy, Sachs, Shamrock, Villan, TrueFab, Mills Bros. and NAHBS. Have also two hoodies: Daltex and 'Cross Reference. Anybody else want me to display their softgoods (on me person), get to packing and shipping. Need a kit and a jacket...(crickets chirping)

[e-RICHIE]

yo great Smoked Out thread atmo.
way to stay on top of the posts with timely and entertaining, informative replies.
i have the box score at wade 52 roe 0.

[dcpdpayne]

Sorry Wade, just thought of another question. As a builder with only a few frames under your belt (at least at this point) how are you looking for your first paying gigs? I'm sure that you have plenty of folks that want to be test mules at a discounted rate, but how are you going to go about going after the full priced customers? Word of mouth? Free bottle of sippin whiskey with every frame? Do tell?

[savine]

Hello Savine, I firmly believe that a man (or woman: Margo, Natalie, Georgiana, et al) doing work he/she loves will produce superior work and that the passion and commitment is obvious in the product/service delivered.

That being said, it's a shame that small business itself is such a pain in the rump or we all might be able to play--and the whole of production might increase in value. That's the real trade-off. Do I love this enough to submit myself to the archaic rules and regulations of the state or should I punch a clock at the widget factory and let somebody else deal with that hassle? Widget making does not equal the business of widget making--you gotta be ready for both sides.

You´ve got that down to a T, though I´m pushing widgets daytime, being husband/father and frame builder on the side. Mans gotta do what a mans gotta do.

[Too Tall]

I admire a man who knows his passion and follows it wherever it goes.
Great lumbering oaf ???? HAHAHA fair fair but you said I looked good, now what am I going to do with that dead fish I had all wrapped up ready to send by parcel post???

You've answered many questions about who you are and what drive the process. With your patience I'd like to shoot some "what if" scenarios your way.

Suppose you were to build a signature event and branded it with the business moniker? Would that lead to more satisfaction for you and are you good with this being a revenue stream?

Yuckity yuck at least you didn't say lumber oaf old man....yet ;)