From Freddy Parr -

[Freddy]

Rules that need attention is securing a supply line.
History shows that unless those are owned for the duration the success of one period won't carry over.

I am worried about talent being discarded for economics here.

Flame me but there is no need to explore beyond talent.

The sensation is already over, and now the dismal removal of options to compete with big industry is back in play.

You all forget too fast.

Federal laws and costly supply only apply to small fab shops, the larger operations have the market wired, and the portion of the small popular builder is to fuel the fire for the next round.

As public demand rises the opinions of venue specialists dims, If it works for you fine, but as it begins it will end as the public becomes aware.

The craft is outside of tech, it is a tech of it's own and with that it can provide, outside of of each venue it is just another bicycle.

May appeal to some but is still a red headed step child of those that spent the time and money to secure it as this years top article.

Sorry if I miss spelled here but there is no Lion here, take it from within if you can, take it from without if you have the resources.

All of your combined stuff is good, you choose?

My formulas are available from Wade, I don't sell anything, I just work.
http://www.cycledesignusa.com/brazing_wire.htm

[e-RICHIE]

freddy -

unless this post is zanc-centric i will move it to the other frame board so all can participate.
please PM asap and i will respectfully wait to hear from you.

thanks.

Rules that need attention is securing a supply line.
History shows that unless those are owned for the duration the success of one period won't carry over.

I am worried about talent being discarded for economics here.

Flame me but there is no need to explore beyond talent.

The sensation is already over, and now the dismal removal of options to compete with big industry is back in play.

You all forget too fast.

Federal laws and costly supply only apply to small fab shops, the larger operations have the market wired, and the portion of the small popular builder is to fuel the fire for the next round.

As public demand rises the opinions of venue specialists dims, If it works for you fine, but as it begins it will end as the public becomes aware.

The craft is outside of tech, it is a tech of it's own and with that it can provide, outside of of each venue it is just another bicycle.

May appeal to some but is still a red headed step child of those that spent the time and money to secure it as this years top article.

Sorry if I miss spelled here but there is no Lion here, take it from within if you can, take it from without if you have the resources.

All of your combined stuff is good, you choose?

[Freddy]

No comment

[e-RICHIE]

i am going to move this to the general frame board so all can post and none of it detracts from mike's thread atmo.

No Richard
Of course I love Zanc but it applies to the food chain.
As tech is in the spotlight the key players on the other end of the supply line.
They see what they made giant companies from, money?
And they will supply up until they don't see it fast in one season of turns.
In the next year the tech will climb again and we as the builders and committee
will have two issues, customers asking for the new tech and the skill and supply
to compete, it is not like your traditional icon for most of the lads.
You commit a traditional execution with complete skill and results.
Time and demand still asks for customs of current tech from the others.
Impasse, if you can't get it you can't do it.

You know me, I like the ride of the well made results of sanity like I would make for you
or you would make for me.

But progress pays the bills in some venues, and despite the how comfortable those can make
it, the bills get paid by that industry competition.

Business is venue first, reliable supply second, skill third, and hope and extra hours?

[Freddy]

No Comment

[Freddy]

No comment

[conorb]

Rules that need attention is securing a supply line.
History shows that unless those are owned for the duration the success of one period won't carry over.

I am worried about talent being discarded for economics here.

Flame me but there is no need to explore beyond talent.

The sensation is already over, and now the dismal removal of options to compete with big industry is back in play.

You all forget too fast.

Federal laws and costly supply only apply to small fab shops, the larger operations have the market wired, and the portion of the small popular builder is to fuel the fire for the next round.

As public demand rises the opinions of venue specialists dims, If it works for you fine, but as it begins it will end as the public becomes aware.

The craft is outside of tech, it is a tech of it's own and with that it can provide, outside of of each venue it is just another bicycle.

May appeal to some but is still a red headed step child of those that spent the time and money to secure it as this years top article.

Sorry if I miss spelled here but there is no Lion here, take it from within if you can, take it from without if you have the resources.

All of your combined stuff is good, you choose?

I've tried to read this twice, maybe three times.

I know what the words mean - individually - but when I put them all together I can't make sense of it.

Like Chewbacca living on Endor.

Conor

[Freddy]

Conor, it is code? ATFO

[Craig Ryan]

Nostradamas with Venus Rising (Botticelli)

[suhacycles]

I've tried to read this twice, maybe three times.

I know what the words mean - individually - but when I put them all together I can't make sense of it.

Like Chewbacca living on Endor.

Conor

I stopped reading the words after a while and decided to FEEL the words... I think I get it now...

Chewbacca may not understand what the Ewoks are saying but I bet he knows when they're pissed off, or in this case cynically optimistic...?

[CyclesNoir]

Forget the words and feel filler!

Got to start playing with the new LFB and fluxes from Freddy. Neat stuff. Temp is obviously a little higher, but it feels much like Filet Pro silver, at the cost of LFB. I think that's very cool.

[Chauncey Matthews]

Forget the words and feel filler!

Got to start playing with the new LFB and fluxes from Freddy. Neat stuff. Temp is obviously a little higher, but it feels much like Filet Pro silver, at the cost of LFB. I think that's very cool.

I can't tell from the Cycledesign site- does the LFB come with flux or is it seperate? The flux link wasn't working for me.

[Freddy]

Chauncey Matthews ?

Yup? the website sucks, that is the only focus this week, to get it cleaned up.
Good news is all the products we designed are now fully available.
Give us a few more days to get those dead links and new pages done.

Meanwhile you can always call me at 520-364-1334 with questions, I get up about one hour before the chickens?
http://www.cycledesignusa.com/brazing_wire.htm

[zank]

Hi Freddy,
Thanks for all that you do. Your continued push to advance joining technology is simply tremendous. I'm really looking forward to trying the new System 48 materials. The increased gap filling capability sounds like a real advancement.
zank

[suhacycles]

Awesome Freddy! Question though: I used your Fillet Pro once to braze up a bottom head lug joint and felt like I needed to put more heat into the joint to get it to flow like 56. How does the 48 stuff compare? Does it have that range of plasticity but at a lower temp? Oh yeah and how much for 5 oz?

Thanks,
Hansen

[Freddy]

Ok Hansen, here is the long version>>>
Fillet Pro is for Fillets - however several of our guys use it for SS lugs instead of 50N, Now that stated>>
System 48 flows like fifty six but you can back out the heat and make a very solid small fillet which cannot be formed as well with 56%.
The Secret is the micro -fined copper alloy and the way this wire is made, the flux creates a second eutectic that increases flow speed and allows feed control like as if you were using two alloys at once.

Many industrial step brazed joints do use two or more alloys at once to make near perfect joints.

So to sum this up, anything you can do easy with 56% "System 48" will work and feel the same. however it can fill larger gaps.
This method allows the builder to use the same alloy and flux for all of the frame construction using lugs.
"Fillet Pro" is for fillet work and this "System 48" will excel for joining SS lugs over any other product.

Did that answer your question, and it is in stock right now !

http://www.cycledesignusa.com/brazing_wire.htm

[suhacycles]

Guess I better use up my 56 real fast - thanks Freddy!

[Freddy]

Thanks Ted, you guys are all special to me. And you Hansen,
My problem is that my health is not what it should be and this year I am taking some time off to take care of myself for a change.
I put everything on fast track so Dave Bohm and Wade B could take the helm.
I am going to put my old Classic Steel web back up on my personal website fredparr.com for info and fun.
I still can't meet Arizona insurance codes to hold formal classes here and it looks dismal that I will be able to.
The choice I had to make was to get all these improved products available or to use what little money I have to set up the school, the choice is done.
I will allow anyone to come and learn, but I can't insure them right now. Play with Freddy at home at your own risk, sorta deal.
System 48 will cost less than 56% but I don't even know how much we paid for it yet?
Wade will set a price in a few days. The bonus about this product is there will be almost no waste, very user easy and torch restrictive, where the heat goes the filler goes.
The eutectic is so close to 56% that most builders will not be able to tell and difference while brazing with it, nice easy to see through paste flux and lowest silver melt temp.
The extra history is that GP Wilson and I used the basic formula way back in the 1970's and now with the flux improvement it only made sense to re-issue it as I have made several hundred builds using the product in the past with a much tamer flux at the time. Tons of Bocama lugged road bikes that went out to club riders around California.
I still have one.
The builders needed a broad range cad-free filler all these years, but it required getting very serious with the Mill to get it made, the new version is made with finer metals and even easier to use.
Yesterday I made a custom batch of flux and it is being shipped to Wade, so all sales for this one needs to go through him, OK?
You all are always welcome to phone me or Wade.. I always have time for questions or just to chat.

Freddy
http://www.cycledesignusa.com/brazing_wire.htm

[edoz]

What's the deal with joining the group? Is it something I don't need to do just to buy more rod and flux?
And are you going to offer the LFB Light flux in a larger size?

[Freddy]

Eric,
You did your best portion, of course you get all the support --thanks for all the help and honesty.
I can't do my job without your feedback, you complete the mission.
Good job !
http://www.cycledesignusa.com/brazing_wire.htm