Car salesman are just like you, they are employees of a company that has policies and procedures that they must follow. It has not always been this way! In the day, when you went into a dealership there would always be a couple of old pros, guys that had been salesman in the same store for years. Raised their families, bought their houses, sent their kids to college and were solid reliable members of their communities. When I first sold cars, we averaged about $100 a car in commission, now 40 years later, with inflation taken into account, salemen should be making about $546.00 a car. In fact they are making about $250 a car. This is why you can't find educated professional salesmen in a mainline car store. in the 60's the markup on a domestic car was 20 -25%, and the luxury marks as much as 35%, and a salesman was paid 25% - 35% of the gross profit. Now, markup ranges from as little as 7% and to a high of 20% and the salespeople get 15 -25%. I made as much money as a salesman in 1972 as most salesman make today, and that doesn't include any adjustment for 40 years of inflation. The other thing that happened is the advent of the "desk system". In the day, you would sit with a salesperson and work out the whole deal, and do the paperwork. Now, the salesperson has no authority to answer any questions regarding price or payment, he has to run back and forth to the manager, the man in the little office that you can't see! It reminds me of the Wizard of Oz, "Pay no attention to the man behind the curtain". Anyway, All of these techniques are because and designed to overcome the increased information available to consumers. No other industry in the world, not one, has it's costs and wholesale pricing published and readily available to anyone that wants to see it. Most customers say they don't want to play the game, but it is the customers that have created the game. If customers simply paid the price that is being asked, the entire process would be clear and simple, and everyone would get an equal, therefore, fair deal.
But the question still remains, what is fair, and what is a good deal? The one you got, because you agreed to it. You have nobody to blame but yourself. The dealer didn't make you sign, he didn't twist your arm, he didn't threaten your family! In the end, YOU made the decision and you are responsible for your deal. If you didn't like it, you shouldn't have signed! It's really that simple! The dealer has to make a profit in order to stay in business, and you don't want him to! Are you being fair to him when you say you want to pay only $200 over invoice on a $30000 product? What sort of profit margin to you have in your industry? Would your business survive without a profit? Would you invest $30000 to make only a 6 tenths of one percent return, no I don't think so, but you think a dealer should do it? And on top of that, you think he should be happy to have an argumentative, aggressive, uncooperative customer accross the desk from him, or worse, just on the phone asking for "his best price". Why would he give it to you, you're not there, and you most likely won't actually buy the car over the phone. You still have to go sit and sign. It's a no win situation for the dealers, and they have only the weak willed dealers among themselves to thank for it. Look at how Harley has been able to maintain retail pricing and excellent resale value, compare that to a Ford or Volkswagon or Nissan. But who has the most loyal and satisfied owner body? Do you think they go hand in glove? Let's talk about another industry for a moment...In retail fashion, who has the best reputation, of course Nordstorm's, and who has the highest markup, and profit and prices, yes that's right, Nordstroms! Always, the most satisfied customers are always the ones that spend the most.
I rant, a little, but it is the truth...
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Originally Posted by echelon_john
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