The world is officially upside down.

[Matthew J]

Lives Matter.
Once you start shouting Black, White, HIspanic.. you institutionalize racism.

I still don't get why someone is called african american when there is not Irish american or Jewish american.
It's all institutionalized racism: make it harder to disappear. Why? Because you create political jobs, you open space for manipulators.

Wrong.

It is very well documented that young African Americans commit crimes at roughly the same rates as other races yet are more likely to be arrested and serve hard time than any other race. Black Lives Matter is a movement attempting to call attention to this fact. It is a necessary and wholly appropriate response to a system that has clearly let an entire segment of the population down.

[j44ke]

This is still, at 7 pages, one of the best discussions on the Internet. I am learning a lot. Thanks to everyone for all the restraint and intelligence shown here.

[Will Neide]

It will have to go somewhere if this country is to go forward. The system was designed at a time when well over 70% of the U.S. was rural and even a greater percentage of the economy was based on agriculture. The United States is now over 85% urban - and the trend is for more, not less consolidation. Agriculture is only around 10% of the GDP.

Yet the system as it is gives rural America and the agriculture sector power far greater than their numbers and economic significance warrant. Yes, there are more House Reps from urban areas than rural. But even there the Senate has shown how easy it is to steer the SCOTUS to a conservative majority that almost certainly will look favorably on the efforts to silence the voice of the urban people through gerrymandering and voter suppression.

At some point people without a voice will give up on a system that offers no hope of ever getting one.

To put this bluntly, no it doesn't. The design is a well thought out design. The landscape changes, and or morphs, and will continue to morph. Change is slow, as it should be. Irrational change is short term thinking, especially when your team doesn't win. We can't always win. The person I wanted to win this time didn't win. I'm not about to trash a well thought out system because my person didn't win. My generation wants trophies just for voting, but the facts are you aren't always on the side that wins. Critically evaluate why you/we lost, listen to the voices that won, learn what could improve, and formulate a plan to act on.

[j44ke]

The process of electing Congress and the President are two different things. The Electoral College controls how the President is elected. Congress is controlled by redistricting at the state level in response to federal census data. I would say that our redistricting process is completely broken and is the easiest place for money to interfere with representative democracy. Gerrymandering has become the rule rather than the exception, and very few people actually pay attention to the way Congressional districts get created.

[Bob Ross]

it was basically a formality on Tuesday to put her in the White House. Then it all fell apart but did anyone see it coming?

At some point after the angst and agita and abject fear abide ...and I do hope that happens soon ...I really want to understand how the most seemingly data-driven pollsters managed to get this one so wrong.

Someone, I forget who, once made a disparaging comment about pianist Dave Brubeck by claiming "the closest he ever got to B was F." (I realize that might be an obscure musician's joke, but it also works as an alphabet paradigm for the sake of this issue.)

Nate Silver played an F.


And that joke also works as a report card paradigm.

[Corso]

[I]
Dare to criticize President Obama? Racist supreme. Never even once been suggested.

Where have you been the last 8 years?

The Top 2 Worst Chris Matthews Quotes Calling Obama Critics Racist

[murphy]

I don't dare attempt to speak for Corso, but i believe his point speaks to the redefinition of the term Racist & Racism.

Racism is such a horrible practice & ideology that even the mere accusation of racist behavior can be devastating. And yes, as of late the mere accusation is considered more than enough to 'convict'.

The president elect is assumed to be a racist because he wants to enforce our nations borders, like any other nation does. Mexico enforces its border to the south & yes deports illegal immigrants. A nation enforcing its sovereign borders shouldn't be conflated with racism.

What you have to keep in mind is the difference between overt racism and systemic racism. In the middle part of the 20th century overt racism was the main issue. White people could restrict the rights of black people. Now though overt racism is generally less prevalent (not gone though) because for the most part people don't tolerate it. That being said though systemic racism is still alive and well. There are systems still in place that have limited the opportunities of minorities in this country. An example of this is the voter ID laws which are being enacted all over the country which generally are designed to impact minorities and those of poorer socioeconomic status. Black lives matter is meant to combat systemic racism along with overt racism.

Also Trump is believed to be a racist not because he wants to enforce our borders, but rather because he has said racist things and had lawsuits against him which detail prejudice. Minorities don't have the privilege not to take his words at face value.

[Corso]

Wrong.

It is very well documented that young African Americans commit crimes at roughly the same rates as other races yet are more likely to be arrested and serve hard time than any other race. Black Lives Matter is a movement attempting to call attention to this fact. It is a necessary and wholly appropriate response to a system that has clearly let an entire segment of the population down.

Mathew, you’re from Chicago, I’m not. So you may have a better handle on the facts. But everything I’ve read supports the point that more African Americans are in jail due to committing more violent crimes, statistically.

Example:

>>Heather Mac Donald writes in her book The War on Cops: How the New Attack on Law and Order Makes Everyone Less Safe that in Chicago, IL, blacks committed 76 percent of all homicides, despite composing 35 percent of the city's population. Blacks also accounted for 78 percent of all juvenile arrests. Whites, who compose 28 percent of the city's population, committed 4 percent of its homicides and 3.5 percent of its juvenile arrests.<<

That said, my heart & brain tell me that yes, a white kid is more likely to get a “break” in a courtroom than an African American. I agree with you. But there are many more factors than just “Black & White”.

[caleb]

At the same time, 46ish% of eligible voters didn't vote, which has a lot of people 'outraged'. I'm not sure how to feel about that. In an ideal world we'd all be well informed and we would vote.

Strategic demobilization of the other side's supporters happens in every election (E.E. Schattschneider's old book The Semi-Sovereign People is still a good explanation), but the consequences in this election were outsized.

Trump had a hard core of supporters who were going to turn out and vote for him absolutely no matter how nasty the race became or what barriers to participation they faced, but that group wasn't large enough to win in a high turnout election. For the sake of illustration let's say his ceiling was 33% of the electorate. How do you win an election with 33% support - but very zealous support - if you can't get more votes? You make sure your opponent gets less than 33%, i.e. you do whatever you can to depress turnout. I don't think we know the effects of gutting the Voting Rights Act on North Carolina and Florida yet, but reducing polling places is one way to drive down turnout. Another is to just get really, really nasty and turn a lot of less zealous voters off, which is exactly what we saw. Negativity works, but it doesn't work equally.

While every campaign is an effort to win voters over, there's also always a shadow campaign of depressing the other side's turnout. It's a strategy that works particularly well when there's a large gap in voter enthusiasm, as there was in this election. That's a long way of saying that the low turnout was a strategic part of the campaign.

[becomingblue]

As if racism is the reason behind EVERYTHING. There were a lot more issues going on that had been building for years that were the driving force behind Trump getting elected.

People responded at the polls. The populace may not be as dumb as the elites thought/hoped.

Again, you don't learn anything by talking to yourself.

[UnfilteredDregs]

I've been utterly depressed all week, I knew this was going to happen, as a VFW I'm appalled. I didn't fight for fascism, although hindsight being 2020 I realize now that I was a cog in the American neo-imperial machine...

Nevertheless, I watched this earlier this morning...sparky Russian women can really cheer one up, I think I'll go for a bike ride finally:

[Cookietruck]

100% agree that the asshats you listed are indeed racist scumbags who have aligned with Trump. BUT I don’t recall Trump ever saying “Glad to have you along boys!” He denounced Duke, remember?

In this country, those idiots have a right to vote for whoever they want. Just the same as a few BLM followers (should I say “your fellow travelers”-who have moved against the police, either with their words or real violence. The BLM group is a direct line to Soros. No debate there. Soros =Left.

As far as my post being a diversion, a diversion from what? I’m not running for office here.

I’m always trying to point out the “Ying to the Yang”, both sides have issues, not just one.

And I have not read one report of the violence against muslims, women or blacks since he was elected. Where was that? If real, this would be ALL OVER the news. Van Jones has been pretty good a speeding this fear.

But I had read reports about violence and vandalism to trump supporters. Pretty sure a Dem agent was caught on tape admitting to hiring agitators to disrupt Trump rallies.

it saddens me to be able to post this
Day 1 In Trump&#39;s America

and it really pisses me off. america has disappointed me...

[UnfilteredDregs]

My biggest fears are an unhinged person who creates a constitutional crisis. Hopefully those fears are unfounded.

Let's not leave out nuclear crisis.

[Sbti]

At least there will be a hot babe in the White House. I really liked her lesbian porn. Make America grope again. Grab 'em by the....... Family Values!

[Corso]

it saddens me to be able to post this
Day 1 In Trump's America

and it really pisses me off. america has disappointed me...

I don’t trust the twitter/facebook universe. Far too easy for some to post anything they want.

I’d rather see police reports on this stuff, where you have something at risk for reporting a lie. I’ve searched. I’ve not found a single one.

Not saying all are manufactured, but it’s far too easy and tempting to do so.

[j44ke]

I don’t trust the twitter/facebook universe. Far too easy for some to post anything they want.

I’d rather see police reports on this stuff, where you have something at risk for reporting a lie. I’ve searched. I’ve not found a single one.

Not saying all are manufactured, but it’s far too easy and tempting to do so.

I agree that the Internet is often not dependable, but I think the standard of requiring a police report in order to believe something happened is probably not a good baseline for truth. It discards far too many events as hypothetical. Anyone involved in victim support in the courts will tell you that these situation are complex and that getting someone to file a report with the police is difficult even when the details are well supported by evidence. Add to an already fractured relationship between the police and some communities in America the fairly high level of support from officers and police unions for Trump, I can understand why someone might report an incident online but resist filing a report with the police. Besides, it isn't necessarily the incidents that are actually criminal that are the most bothersome and serious. Writing derogatory things on someone's car is vandalism, but saying those same things may not actually be a crime, though it is no less disrespectful, violent and immoral.

[UnfilteredDregs]

But he's not dumb. He's also definitely NOT conflict averse. If you've ever dealt with a contractor in NYC, they all bank on most of their customers being more conflict averse than they are. They'll call your mother a whore to your face and all sorts of things you'd never imagine in a civilized world, but if you can survive the onslaught, they'll honor the price on the contract as originally negotiated. Otherwise you pay a fee to have it all over and done with and for them to just go away.

As a New Yorker I'm horrified, and laughing!

[Corso]

I agree that the Internet is often not dependable, but I think the standard of requiring a police report in order to believe something happened is probably not a good baseline for truth. It discards far too many events as hypothetical. Anyone involved in victim support in the courts will tell you that these situation are complex and that getting someone to file a report with the police is difficult even when the details are well supported by evidence. Add to an already fractured relationship between the police and some communities in America the fairly high level of support from officers and police unions for Trump, I can understand why someone might report an incident online but resist filing a report with the police. Besides, it isn't necessarily the incidents that are actually criminal that are the most bothersome and serious. Writing derogatory things on someone's car is vandalism, but saying those same things may not actually be a crime, though it is no less disrespectful, violent and immoral.

Well said.

[colker]

I don’t trust the twitter/facebook universe. Far too easy for some to post anything they want.

I’d rather see police reports on this stuff, where you have something at risk for reporting a lie. I’ve searched. I’ve not found a single one.

Not saying all are manufactured, but it’s far too easy and tempting to do so.

Facebook made Lying fun again. Was Facebook specifically created for annoying everybody w/ your politics and bullying? If so that´s a huge success.

[murphy]

I don’t trust the twitter/facebook universe. Far too easy for some to post anything they want.

I’d rather see police reports on this stuff, where you have something at risk for reporting a lie. I’ve searched. I’ve not found a single one.

Not saying all are manufactured, but it’s far too easy and tempting to do so.

It is on the New York Times' front page with multiple incidents. It mentions some fakes, but many are not.