Uhm . . . car racing?

[HorsCat]

F1 drivers are better - race car drivers - than Indy drivers. As in, F1'ers have made the switch to Indy successfully, whereas Indy'ers have not made the switch to F1 successfully (unless your last name is "Andretti," and only then if it includes "Mario Gabriele").

[Christian Fox]

F1 drivers are better - race car drivers - than Indy drivers. As in, F1'ers have made the switch to Indy successfully, whereas Indy'ers have not made the switch to F1 successfully (unless your last name is "Andretti," and only then if it includes "Mario Gabriele").

Yeah, Michael Andretti had a pretty miserable run with Mclaren. Dennis recruited him hard, too. Michael was a master with the heavier, more powerful Indy cars, but was lost in F1. F1 drivers have been terrible in stock cars though (except, of course, Mario). Montoya and Kimi are the lastest examples, and both were gawd awful.

[Jocko Homo]

Was Montoya terrible in NASCAR? I thought he won a couple times?

That guy was pretty ballsy in F1. Fun to watch in it.

[Christian Fox]

Was Montoya terrible in NASCAR? I thought he won a couple times?

That guy was pretty ballsy in F1. Fun to watch in it.

I think he won a couple of road courses over five or six years, one was in the Nationwide series, I think. Just in comparison to his F1, Indy and endurance racing, his time is stock cars was very mediocre.

[Crashburn]

SK, your Irish moto buddies are INSANE, and it's awesome to watch. Seems like the last bit of motorsport that safety hasn't wrangled and sanitized. Not that I'm opposed to motorsport being safe, but it's absolutely awesome to watch motor racing on a straight up road course. How big of a compartment do they have to mold into those bikes for their attachments, said attachments must be HUGE!

Oh come on I'm sure those mattress wrapped phone poles have saved ones of lives during the entire history of Irish road racing.

As far as F1 costs being constrained the budgets are FAR greater than they were twenty years ago and any money saved by eliminating qualifying exhausts and an unlimited supply of engines is eaten up by countless hours spent in wind tunnels. I'd be curious to see how fast one of the dominating McLarens of the Senna/Prost era would be with modern tire compounds, well modern tires before Pirelli was instructed to make them so fragile, and paddle shift transmissions.

[Christian Fox]

Oh come on I'm sure those mattress wrapped phone poles have saved ones of lives during the entire history of Irish road racing.

As far as F1 costs being constrained the budgets are FAR greater than they were twenty years ago and any money saved by eliminating qualifying exhausts and an unlimited supply of engines is eaten up by countless hours spent in wind tunnels. I'd be curious to see how fast one of the dominating McLarens of the Senna/Prost era would be with modern tire compounds, well modern tires before Pirelli was instructed to make them so fragile, and paddle shift transmissions.

Me too. I remember a Top Gear where Hamilton drove Senna's MP4/4. I was actually surprised he got it around the track with the manual gear box and no launch control. Cars of that era were 900bhp go karts and brutally hard to drive. It's funny, I don't recall anyone complaining about the sound of v6 turbos back then, I wonder why it's such a big deal now?

[sk_tle]

It's called resistance to change.

[Jocko Homo]

Those 80s motorsport turbo cars were completely wacky compared to whats around these days though. And they sounded as crazy as the amount of HP they were allowed to put out.

[choke]

F1 drivers are better - race car drivers - than Indy drivers. As in, F1'ers have made the switch to Indy successfully, whereas Indy'ers have not made the switch to F1 successfully (unless your last name is "Andretti," and only then if it includes "Mario Gabriele").

I seem to recall that Jacques Villeneuve did relatively well when he went from IndyCar to F1.

[theflashunc]

Me too. I remember a Top Gear where Hamilton drove Senna's MP4/4. I was actually surprised he got it around the track with the manual gear box and no launch control. Cars of that era were 900bhp go karts and brutally hard to drive. It's funny, I don't recall anyone complaining about the sound of v6 turbos back then, I wonder why it's such a big deal now?

It's called resistance to change.

I'm personally a fan of the new engine notes. Reminiscent of the wacky Group B rally stuff from the 80's before those cars, yanno, killed everyone.

[bking]

deleted

[Christian Fox]

I seem to recall that Jacques Villeneuve did relatively well when he went from IndyCar to F1.

great example, but there have been a ton of Indy Cars drivers who have been given F1 tests, and 99% of them went nowhere. In regards to F1 drivers being "the best" I'm going back and saying the statement needs a bit of qualification. I'd say F1 attracts the very best to the top few seats, but below that it's a lot of regional sponsorship politics and "cash and crash" drivers; essentially buying a seat with a huge hometown sponsor backing them (Crashdor Maldonado being an example). I refuse to believe someone like Dario Franchitti wouldn't have been more successful in F1 than any number of guys like Maldonado.

[Maxspeedwell]

Twenty years ago tomorrow.
Twenty years ago today Barichello was knocked unconscious and broke his nose, then Ratzenberger
was killed just a little later. The next day we lost Senna. His brilliance is clearly seen at Donnington
in the rain, coming through the chicane at Piscene, and his first test drive with Williams.

Clark was brilliant as was Stewart, and Schumacher was relentless but Senna was truly gifted.

[Mike Mcdermid]

F1, politics and "cash"

I narrowed it down to far less words for you

[Maxspeedwell]

Cash and politics... and more cash.


Here's an interesting list in ascending order of price:


*Buying a ride in the space shuttle

*Ballet company

*Mega yacht

*F1 team for a season

*Buying a member of congress (keep your U.S. dollars working at home)

*Illicit girlfriend


When you look at the cost this way it makes F1 look like a bargain.

[Christian Fox]

Cash and politics... and more cash.


Here's an interesting list in ascending order of price:


*Buying a ride in the space shuttle

*Ballet company

*Mega yacht

*F1 team for a season

*Buying a member of congress (keep your U.S. dollars working at home)

*Illicit girlfriend


When you look at the cost this way it makes F1 look like a bargain.

I don't know if Gene Haas is interested in anything else on the list, but he's gotten the go-ahead from Bernie to start a US based F1 team next year. Pretty cool; I hope some young American drivers get a shot at a seat (my nine year kart racing son thinks this is the start of his big chance...shhhh). I cannot fathom how difficult it will be to develop a team from the ground up. I'm wondering if they will actually be based in the US rather than the usual UK? Logistically that would be pretty tough/expensive. It would be much easier just to buy one of the cash-strapped back marker teams, but I think I read Haas is going to develop a new one. It will be interesting to watch.

[Badonkadonk]

(my nine year kart racing son thinks this is the start of his big chance...shhhh).

I don't know if this is a typo and your son is nine years old, or if your son is older and has been karting for nine years, but either way, let me assure the internet - you look great for having that kind of mileage on the clock. congrats. please send fountain-of-late-20s directions to me via PM.

Regards,
Badonk, feeling mortal and grey

[vertical_doug]

I don't know if Gene Haas is interested in anything else on the list, but he's gotten the go-ahead from Bernie to start a US based F1 team next year. Pretty cool; I hope some young American drivers get a shot at a seat (my nine year kart racing son thinks this is the start of his big chance...shhhh). I cannot fathom how difficult it will be to develop a team from the ground up. I'm wondering if they will actually be based in the US rather than the usual UK? Logistically that would be pretty tough/expensive. It would be much easier just to buy one of the cash-strapped back marker teams, but I think I read Haas is going to develop a new one. It will be interesting to watch.

BBC Panorama had a special on Bernie and his illicit off shore trusts, bribes and just about everything else along the way. I hope the Germans convict him and throw him in jail.

[Christian Fox]

I don't know if this is a typo and your son is nine years old, or if your son is older and has been karting for nine years, but either way, let me assure the internet - you look great for having that kind of mileage on the clock. congrats. please send fountain-of-late-20s directions to me via PM.

Regards,
Badonk, feeling mortal and grey

Ha! thank you!! He's nine, his sister is twelve, I'll be 44 in August. I'm not very good at much in the world, but I do look kinda young. I still get carded sometimes. The flip side to that is that I looked about twelve as a senior in high school with all of the attendant issues that come with that.

BBC Panorama had a special on Bernie and his illicit off shore trusts, bribes and just about everything else along the way. I hope the Germans convict him and throw him in jail.

so true. I chuckle when they promote all the glitz and glamor of F1 then cut to a shot of....Bernie. He looks like Andy Warhol's perverted uncle. Also funny is that he's an actual former used car salesman. Now he sells more expensive cars.

[Mike Mcdermid]

I don't know if Gene Haas is interested in anything else on the list, but he's gotten the go-ahead from Bernie to start a US based F1 team next year. Pretty cool; I hope some young American drivers get a shot at a seat (my nine year kart racing son thinks this is the start of his big chance...shhhh). I cannot fathom how difficult it will be to develop a team from the ground up. I'm wondering if they will actually be based in the US rather than the usual UK? Logistically that would be pretty tough/expensive. It would be much easier just to buy one of the cash-strapped back marker teams, but I think I read Haas is going to develop a new one. It will be interesting to watch.

I remember when us f1 tried hiring .....basically no one was interested to compete in f1 it seems you need engineers who work in f1 which is predominately uk based or you hire the uk pool the only benefit Haas will have is that he might make more than a nose cone and not end up with egg on his face....if he thinks he's going to compete from day 1 with a new car and team then id say you got much more chance of finding aliens in roswell