Minneapolis Social Injustice and Related

[rowdyhillrambler]

Davids, Of COURSE the murder(s) by the Police are horrible, it goes without saying.

And as I stated before, it's the 11 dead and hundreds injured that is paramount to the property and looting. It's the whole package.

Violence is met with Police, because (like it or not) it's their job. So if the violence stops (not the protest, the violence and crime), the Police don't respond in the same way. The "agitators" know their actions bring the Police, the cycle continues. The Police haven't had time to suddenly weed out the bad, be re-trained, union busted, reformed as needed, etc).

Don't we want all the violence to stop so everyone can begin the "change"?- for lack of a better term. 2nd thought, not all of us- I guess the anarchist want to keep up the cycle...

You are confusing anarchy with chaos-it’s not the same thing.. It’s just not.

I’ve lived in several communes and co-operatives. I understand anarchy in its practice-we we’re not violent or burning down each other’s house-

Problem that most folks don’t want to realize is that both capitalism and communism have a Utopian end-anarchy doesn’t

I’m not sure who to credit with this concept, ‘good people don’t need laws and bad people don’t follow them.. so what’s the point’

I won’t argue for anarchy here, it’s not the place.

But, don’t blame the anarchists for wanting to keep up the cycle.. anarchy does not mean violence

[rowdyhillrambler]

Also-minneapolis city council disbands police and going Community based???? I just read that.. Fuck-hold on

Is this any sort of true?

[Corso]

Apologies, I'll let you continue your blithe, patronizing assertions.

The cops are the problem. Even in a week where people protesting police brutality, the police bring brutality to those protests. The only out of control group I've consistently seen across the country the last week are cops.

Police forces are fundamentally broken in this country, from their actions to their protection of the "bad cops" with too few "good cops" speaking out. Time to try something different.

And I'll let you continue to keep your blinders on. So I guess we have an understanding.

Cops the only ones out of control?

George Floyd Protests: 1,258 Arrested, 13 Police Officers Injured in Chicago | Chicago News | WTTW

That's 130 Police injured in a a 60 hour period in Chicago alone. I believe NY had about 290 police injured in one night. Who knows what the 2 week total of injuries and death (to all parties) will tally.

You think the Police are beating themselves? Shooting at themselves? Lighting their own cars on fire?

I agree on your last sentence, I think everyone here has already said this again and again.

But don't turn a blind eye to the reality of the recent situation. If so, you're no better than the cops who do the same.

[theflashunc]

And I'll let you continue to keep your blinders on. So I guess we have an understanding.

Cops the only ones out of control?

George Floyd Protests: 1,258 Arrested, 13 Police Officers Injured in Chicago | Chicago News | WTTW

That's 130 Police injured in a a 60 hour period in Chicago alone. I believe NY had about 290 police injured in one night. Who knows what the 2 week total of injuries and death (to all parties) will tally.

You think the Police are beating themselves? Shooting at themselves? Lighting their own cars on fire?

I agree on your last sentence, I think everyone here has already said this again and again.

But don't turn a blind eye to the reality of the recent situation. If so, you're no better than the cops who do the same.

Any dead cops?

How's that stack up against injured protestors? Those hit with less lethal rubber bullet rounds, or hit with chemical weapons like tear gas (banned from the battlefield fwiw), or just simply had the shit kicked out of them by cops?

Cops also have the luxury of not being injured at these protests by not being cops and finding another line of work. Communities of color don't have that luxury.

So no, I'm not going to handwring for cops that have completely shit the bed in how they police communities. This was a week where they could have shown they aren't what the protestors claim they are, but they've spent the week doing anything but.

[caleb]

Also-minneapolis city council disbands police and going Community based???? I just read that.. Fuck-hold on

Is this any sort of true?

Sort of. The City Council is short on specifics. The essential element from my reading is that we're going to lock the union (federation; it's not really a union) out and get a fresh start.

We'll have a police force, it's just going to be smaller and part of a larger public safety effort. Maybe we cut the police part in half, and take the other half to fund trained people to intervene in mental health and other sorts of nonviolent situations. The alarmists want to portray this as a no-police-at-all resolution, which isn't going to happen.

Our overpaid police force has been a colossal failure. What else should we expect when we pull guys off the line at McDonald's (immediate previous employment for two of the involved cops) with the offer of a gun and $100k+/year? Why continue throwing good money after what the past two weeks has shown us is a bad investment? Let's cut em loose and try something new. If nothing else at all comes of it, we'll at least have a chance to fire all the officers with bad track records.

We need a basic mentality change. The cops work for us. We have no other way to get that message across, so everyone is getting fired. If they want their jobs back, it's going to be on our terms.

And hopefully when we show it can be done there'll be ripple effects across the country with police departments waking up to the fact that they need to work for the public or they're going to need to look for new jobs.

[Corso]

Any dead cops?

A comprehensive list of police officers injured or killed in US riots – True North

if you cared at all about your question, you could have found info in about 3 seconds.

St. Louis: Man charged in David Dorn'''s murder | ksdk.com

But you don't care.

And that's the problem. If everyone takes sides and only cares about that, nothing will change. I don't want to see ANYONE hurt, and have said this from day 1 of this mess.

[Todd Amunrud]

"from day 1 of this mess"

Day one has been going on for many decades if your skin is of darker complexion...

[theflashunc]

A comprehensive list of police officers injured or killed in US riots – True North

if you cared at all about your question, you could have found info in about 3 seconds.

St. Louis: Man charged in David Dorn'''s murder | ksdk.com

But you don't care.

And that's the problem. If everyone takes sides and only cares about that, nothing will change. I don't want to see ANYONE hurt, and have said this from day 1 of this mess.

About how cops are suffering at the moment? You're right, I don't. Because again, it's a job, and by and large they are monstrously shitty at it and have been for a long, long time. They have a complete opt out from any violence that's perpetrated against them. Communities of color don't. And police have all manner of concern and handwringing and whinging for them that has existed for a very long time in this country. The longest running TV show in American history is a fantasia about the protective and just nature of police officers, and a spin-off of the second longest running TV show in American history, yet another fantasia about the benevolent righteousness of police and the justice system. How much love and appreciation do we see for First Responders of all stripes, at any occasion where we even need just drop the hate. Are there times they've risen to the moment? Of course. But in the day-to-day drudgery of police work, cops as an institution continue to fail more people in this country than they help.

So no, I'm not losing sleep for cops through all this. They've got enough people worried about them as it is. I'm more worried about the people they terrorize every day.

And specifically, I meant your reference to the 130 injured in Chicago. Which, again, none of this would be happening if yet another shithead cop didn't keep his knee on George Floyd's neck for the better part of the length of a Rick & Morty episode. If there are good cops, then it's well-past time for them to start kicking the shit ones to the curb.

[rowdyhillrambler]

About how cops are suffering at the moment? You're right, I don't. Because again, it's a job, and by and large they are monstrously shitty at it and have been for a long, long time. They have a complete opt out from any violence that's perpetrated against them. Communities of color don't. And police have all manner of concern and handwringing and whinging for them that has existed for a very long time in this country. The longest running TV show in American history is a fantasia about the protective and just nature of police officers, and a spin-off of the second longest running TV show in American history, yet another fantasia about the benevolent righteousness of police and the justice system. How much love and appreciation do we see for First Responders of all stripes, at any occasion where we even need just drop the hate. Are there times they've risen to the moment? Of course. But in the day-to-day drudgery of police work, cops as an institution continue to fail more people in this country than they help.

So no, I'm not losing sleep for cops through all this. They've got enough people worried about them as it is. I'm more worried about the people they terrorize every day.

And specifically, I meant your reference to the 130 injured in Chicago. Which, again, none of this would be happening if yet another shithead cop didn't keep his knee on George Floyd's neck for the better part of the length of a Rick & Morty episode. If there are good cops, then it's well-past time for them to start kicking the shit ones to the curb.

Amen

[Corso]

But in the day-to-day drudgery of police work, cops as an institution continue to fail more people in this country than they help.

Completely absurd statement. Yes, they have failed in many cases, but more than they help? If so, there would be no Police.

So the retired black captain who was killed deserved it? Shed no tears huh? All Police of color are all to blame also? How many big city Police Commissioners are African American? I've seen quite a few on the news recently. You have a beef with them too?

"if there are good cops"? Like I said earlier, I believe you are arguing the same points for the sake of argument.

"It's a job"... A job with your apparent attitude, you could never do yourself.

[theflashunc]

Completely absurd statement. Yes, they have failed in many cases, but more than they help? If so, there would be no Police.

So the retired black captain who was killed deserved it? Shed no tears huh? All Police of color are all to blame also? How many big city Police Commissioners are African American? I've seen quite a few on the news recently. You have a beef with them too?

"if there are good cops"? Like I said earlier, I believe you are arguing the same points for the sake of argument.

"It's a job"... A job with your apparent attitude, you could never do yourself.

No, it's why I'm not a cop. But if the bar is the same attitude many of the shitheads we currently have as cops are cops, sure, I'll give it a go. Certainly can't be any worse than the people we have doing it now.

And yeah, all cops. We're well past the point of unjustified police brutality with broad silence from those on the force that their lack of outspoken repudiation is an implicit statement of support for their shitheel brothers in arms.

I could be a cynic and say there's Uncle Tom's everywhere, but sure, let's give them the benefit of the doubt.

[Corso]

No, it's why I'm not a cop. But if the bar is the same attitude many of the shitheads we currently have as cops are cops, sure, I'll give it a go. Certainly can't be any worse than the people we have doing it now.

And yeah, all cops. We're well past the point of unjustified police brutality with broad silence from those on the force that their lack of outspoken repudiation is an implicit statement of support for their shitheel brothers in arms.

I could be a cynic and say there's Uncle Tom's everywhere, but sure, let's give them the benefit of the doubt.

Thank you for your clarification on "all cops". We now know exactly where you stand. I'll let you have the last word with that.

[Rich Beaudoin]

A comprehensive list of police officers injured or killed in US riots – True North

I read the article partly because someone I love told me yesterday that 50+ police have been killed by protesters in the last week. However, in the article you posted the ‘comprehensive list’ shows two officers killed (1 police in Las Vegas and 1 FBI in Oakland).
Regarding the injury reports, with thousands of protesters across the nation - this list sounds pretty short in comparison to the injuries documented and caused by the police.

[chasea]

[mjbabcock]

On the idea of policing being a job that no one wants...I’d argue that generations and generations of exponentially more violent policing may have something to do with the horrible conditions many officers face. These aren’t the beat cops of yesteryear who know their neighbors and keep the peace in the neighborhoods.

Well, there’s that and the idea that these folks enforced Jim Crow laws and racialized policing practices in generations past. I think I’ll go rd-read Michelle Alexander’s book.

[Mabouya]

I truly hope you never find yourself in a position where you actually need to call the Police. But someday you just might.

So that's the choice in this country?

Either no police, or we allow the police to run amok, even commit murder, with no repercussions to the bad ones?

There's no third alternative?

Let me suggest one: competent law enforcement by people who don't have the need to go on power trips (or worse) when dealing with the public they've been hired to "Protect and Serve."

[thollandpe]

I believe that right now the biggest enemy of the police is the ongoing record of awful conduct. The militarized hardware and tactics designed to “dominate” the situation were inappropriate at best, and intended to inflame and incite at worst.

It started with the killing of George Floyd, the snuff film that is absolutely sickening. But it didn’t actually start there. Ahmaud Arbery was hunted down and murdered by an ex-cop and his son in a suburban neighborhood, because of the color of his skin. The perps were initially let free, no charges filed. Breonna Taylor, an EMT, was killed by police with a no-knock warrant. After shooting her eight times they still searched her apartment for drugs (and found none). Trayvon Martin, 12-year-old Tamir Rice, Sandra Bland, Philando Castile, Eric Garner, Freddie Gray, Botham Jean — say their names. Do not forget.

But it has certainly not stopped there. Cell phones document daily examples of abuse and overreach.

• Buffalo PD lays out a 75-year-old man flat on the concrete, and marches right on by as he lay bleeding from his ears.
• LAPD fires a “non-lethal” round at close range into the face of a man in a wheelchair.
• Atlanta PD smash the windows, slash the tires, apply tasers to two college students and pull them from their car for being out after curfew.
• In Minneapolis, a phalanx of police led by a humvee, who act like they’re pretending to clear a block in Fallujah, shout “Light ‘em up!” before firing pepper balls at a group of young women standing on their front porch.
• An officer in Erie PA maced and kicked over a woman sitting on the ground as he walked by.
• NYPD broke Huascar Benoit’s face to get him out of the way.
• Asheville PD slashed and stomped water bottles as they busted up a first aid station.

This list could stretch for pages, but let me wrap it up by pointing out that we have seen the sadistic abuse of rubber bullets, pepper spray, pepper balls, bean bags, flash-bang grenades, and tear gas. They have and have used LRADs. Helicopters with Red Cross markings executed low-altitude crowd dispersal maneuvers. Some, such as our bald-faced liar Attorney General, want to parse whether it was actually tear gas or not that was used to move clergy from an aid station and sanctuary.

The fact is that these protests are ongoing because they are legitimate. And the botched police response has made them even more necessary. They are also getting more peaceful as the violent enforcement of arbitrary curfews is stopped. And as some police departments run out of tear gas.

I am urging friends and family who are police, friends and family of police, to write their chiefs, the commissioners, their unions, and the PBAs to ask them to stop using anti-riot tactics on these protests. Because I believe that de-militarizing our police forces, in both training and hardware, is the only way to save them. And save us.

[robin3mj]

I believe that right now the biggest enemy of the police is the ongoing record of awful conduct. The militarized hardware and tactics designed to “dominate” the situation were inappropriate at best, and intended to inflame and incite at worst.

It started with the killing of George Floyd, the snuff film that is absolutely sickening. But it didn’t actually start there. Ahmaud Arbery was hunted down and murdered by an ex-cop and his son in a suburban neighborhood, because of the color of his skin. The perps were initially let free, no charges filed. Breonna Taylor, an EMT, was killed by police with a no-knock warrant. After shooting her eight times they still searched her apartment for drugs (and found none). Trayvon Martin, 12-year-old Tamir Rice, Sandra Bland, Philando Castile, Eric Garner, Freddie Gray, Botham Jean — say their names. Do not forget.

But it has certainly not stopped there. Cell phones document daily examples of abuse and overreach.

• Buffalo PD lays out a 75-year-old man flat on the concrete, and marches right on by as he lay bleeding from his ears.
• LAPD fires a “non-lethal” round at close range into the face of a man in a wheelchair.
• Atlanta PD smash the windows, slash the tires, apply tasers to two college students and pull them from their car for being out after curfew.
• In Minneapolis, a phalanx of police led by a humvee, who act like they’re pretending to clear a block in Fallujah, shout “Light ‘em up!” before firing pepper balls at a group of young women standing on their front porch.
• An officer in Erie PA maced and kicked over a woman sitting on the ground as he walked by.
• NYPD broke Huascar Benoit’s face to get him out of the way.
• Asheville PD slashed and stomped water bottles as they busted up a first aid station.

This list could stretch for pages, but let me wrap it up by pointing out that we have seen the sadistic abuse of rubber bullets, pepper spray, pepper balls, bean bags, flash-bang grenades, and tear gas. They have and have used LRADs. Helicopters with Red Cross markings executed low-altitude crowd dispersal maneuvers. Some, such as our bald-faced liar Attorney General, want to parse whether it was actually tear gas or not that was used to move clergy from an aid station and sanctuary.

The fact is that these protests are ongoing because they are legitimate. And the botched police response has made them even more necessary. They are also getting more peaceful as the violent enforcement of arbitrary curfews is stopped. And as some police departments run out of tear gas.

I am urging friends and family who are police, friends and family of police, to write their chiefs, the commissioners, their unions, and the PBAs to ask them to stop using anti-riot tactics on these protests. Because I believe that de-militarizing our police forces, in both training and hardware, is the only way to save them. And save us.

Levi Ayala Went to Watch History at an Austin Protest and Instead Became a Tragic Part of It – Texas Monthly

[Clean39T]

Portland Reporter Pens First-Person Account of Being Pepper-Sprayed While Filming an Arrest - Willamette Week

The Portland Police Bureau is completely out of control. The Mayor is complicit. The Chief doesn't care.

All we can do is spread information and hope someone, somewhere, further up the food chain will do something.

[sk_tle]

The police forces must be disarmed now. Everything that happened these last few days shows they don't know how, why and when to operate them.