Retirement thoughts/plans/dreams

[fastupslowdown]

I love France/Switzerland/Italy anywhere near the Alps, so count me in the group purchase.
I just turned 52 but still feel like I'm in my prime. Financially we have a reasonable amount saved and less than that one year until our home is paid off (we planned it out a long time ago in expectation of kids college expenses).
The wild card for us is inheritance that my father-in-law talks about. My wife and I say they'll burn thru everything.
We also made the choice twenty years ago to live here even though we would have had higher income potential elsewhere.

52 must be the magic number. that's where i am and i've been thinking about this a lot. i'm about to sit down with a financial planner and start going through the math.

[ldamelio]

You might find this article interesting:A Retirement Plan With Less Golf but More Satisfaction - The New York Times

The gist is that the old model of retirement was to work hard from 25-65 so that you could retire at 65 and play golf, but that's not a particularly good model at maximizing lifetime happiness for most people. The author encourages people to instead consider maximizing enjoyment earlier in life even if it means less income, because that increased enjoyment can allow you to work longer and find satisfaction in it.

For the younger Salonistas, this is the key - sustainability and long term work-life balance. Do what you love at a comfortable pace for a long time.

For us older guys (I'm 57), it depends on where you are and what you've done. I've paced myself poorly in life - always had to be the youngest to do X, take the hardest path, etc. I've been a knucklehead in the breakaway of life. Accomplished a lot that I'm proud of and have done some good for the world, but I'm fried. Missed my kids growing up and have been work-bonking for a while. Just made a job change that I thought would improve my work-life balance but it didn't. I have no objective complaints - it's still meaningful work and I'm well-respected, challenged, appreciated, etc. It's just very hard and I have very little in the mental tank. I've saved enough to retire comfortably by most objective standards. Right now I'm still working hard because I feel an obligation to contribute meaningfully in the world and a bigger cushion is always better especially if I have exceptional longevity. I'd also like to leave a bundle for grandchildren's education, etc. However, I know all too well that life is short. 60 and out for me. Maybe a few months to recover and then volunteer in my field, do some consulting, etc. Maybe I'm just going to ride my bike, curl up with my wife, roast some coffee, etc. We'll see. If any of you find me on here whining about work in three years, slap me around.

[SteveP]

i would add...the years keep rolling by whatever you do.

think about where you want to be in 5,10, 15 years.
then work toward making it happen.
the calendar turns whether you plan for something or dont.

i had a 20 yr plan to sell the business i started w a partner at the end of 20 yrs.
worked on schedule. sold the biz, worked* for the new owner for as long as i enjoyed it.
retired. boom.

* straight w-2 work is like being retired after years of operating the business...
employees, inventory, financing, multiple headaches all gone!

[Too Tall]

Lou - start roasting now please.

I get the feeling that in 5 or 6 years a bunch of us are going to have alot of free time.

VsalonBum, has a nice ring to it.

[summilux]

I get the feeling that in 5 or 6 years a bunch of us are going to have alot of free time in France.

Fixed it for ya.

[NYCfixie]

It was mostly a joke, but I assume you do agree that the close and closer one gets to retirement the less aggressive his/her portfolio should be.

not necessarily. when people retire/retired at 65 and only live until about 70-72, they needed to be conservative at the end. Now with people retiring at 65, or earlier as the topic of this thread, and living much longer into your 80s and possibly 90s, you need to continue to be "mildly" aggressive and have your money work for you to support all those extra years.

[joosttx]

not necessarily. when people retire/retired at 65 and only live until about 70-72, they needed to be conservative at the end. Now with people retiring at 65, or earlier as the topic of this thread, and living much longer into your 80s and possibly 90s, you need to continue to be "mildly" aggressive and have your money work for you to support all those extra years.

I would suggest you should have enough of a stash to live off the income conserative investing produces in your later years. Its a lot safer / easier to make $100k/year at a 3% return than $75K at 8% return. You can make 3-5% income generating returns in the worse of condition I have experienced in my lifetime. Getting risky even mildly risky (what ever that is) during and close to your retirement years is a bad idea especially if you dont know what you are doing. I mean what happens is you lose. What are you going to do then??????

[joosttx]

Lou - start roasting now please.

I get the feeling that in 5 or 6 years a bunch of us are going to have alot of free time.

VsalonBum, has a nice ring to it.

VsalonBum. I need a tshirt.

[NYCfixie]

Maybe I should have said mildly conservative rather than mildly aggressive but we are saying the same thing.

You should live off the investment income when you retire rather than the investment itself. Just make sure you have enough principall.

100k @ 3% assumes a little more than 3 million in investments.

75k @ 8% assumes just under 1 million in investments.

The key to either strategy is too plan ahead knowing that some years will be better then others. If your have a good year while in retirement don't blow your wad. Put the extra income nto cash savings and save it for a year when you do not make as much investment income.

Again, it is all about starting early and having a plan.

I would suggest you should have enough of a stash to live off the income conserative investing produces in your later years. Its a lot safer / easier to make $100k/year at a 3% return than $75K at 8% return. You can make 3-5% income generating returns in the worse of condition I have experienced in my lifetime. Getting risky even mildly risky (what ever that is) during and close to your retirement years is a bad idea especially if you dont know what you are doing. I mean what happens is you lose. What are you going to do then??????

[rec head]

These are some pretty early retirement ages people are throwing out. Good for you. I'm hoping to be done at 56 with 25 years of service. The stats: turning 43 next week. Married. No kids. Wife has a good job and better earning potential. She works for the state now but the way their pension is setup she won't get much. I won't be surprised if she works in some capacity for much longer. She can work from almost anywhere. I work for the city will get if I go at 56 will get 65% of my salary. I'd max out at 75% if I stayed til 60. I'd get forced off at 63.

One point the old timers have made is that if I save responsibly (I think I am) that when I retire I should be living on about the same as my take home pay when I retire because I won't be paying pension and deferred comp and taxes will be lower. Every raise goes to deferred comp. I don't need to buy bikes at a faster rate. Another bonus is that while I didn't buy my 3 flat at the bottom of the market we did get it at a good time. The 15 year mortgage will be paid off by the time I retire.

I think about retirement just about everyday. I can't wait to live somewhere I don't have to see snow and have better access to better rides. Everywhere we go ask we ourselves if we could live there. South of France is a yes. Same with New Zealand. Spain is supposed to be an easy place for U.S. citizens to retire to but I haven't really been there. I could definitely see buying into a French bike commune. I have a frenchie staying with me right now and he said that French mortgage rates are super low right now...

[joosttx]

I think you are missing my point.

Maybe I should have said mildly conservative rather than mildly aggressive but we are saying the same thing.

You should live off the investment income when you retire rather than the investment itself. Just make sure you have enough principall.

100k @ 3% assumes a little more than 3 million in investments.

75k @ 8% assumes just under 1 million in investments.

The key to either strategy is too plan ahead knowing that some years will be better then others. If your have a good year while in retirement don't blow your wad. Put the extra income nto cash savings and save it for a year when you do not make as much investment income.

Again, it is all about starting early and having a plan.

[NYCfixie]

I think you are missing my point.

Probably, at least that is what my wife always says (and the inherent problem with email and internet posts).

[SteveP]

i thk the gist of a lot of this is that you have to do the planning and the preparation yourself,,, and start now.
the clock is ticking.
the longer you defer the further away is the target.

and have other interests than work!

[prcrstn8]

"Wow, you look great, what have you been doing since you retired?"
"Nothing*."
"But don't you get bored?"
"No."





*skiing, cycling, swimming, reading, skiing, working out, lots of walking, and plenty of sleeping.

[bking]

I'll never retire. I like seeing people and opportunities grow and being a part of that.
I'm fortunate, I own a business I enjoy, and began my "stepping back" as opposed to stepping out program about 8 or 9 years ago by replacing me on a day to day basis. I've "replaced" me with people who are better and smarter at doing what they do than I ever was. I'm 61 now and while I'm able to take the time to do what I want to do, I'll always have an office, at work.

[caleb]

For the younger Salonistas, this is the key - sustainability and long term work-life balance. Do what you love at a comfortable pace for a long time.

Question for all the older guys who are feeling like they've had enough: Did the feeling that work wasn't indefinitely sustainable always exist, gradually build, come from some particular event, or have a different trajectory?

I ask because I have colleagues in their 70s, and in my line of work it's not uncommon to work beyond conventional retirement years. On the other hand, I also work with people who are counting the days to retirement in their 50s. As a guy in my mid-30s, I could see myself being someone who works for a very long time because I enjoy what I do, but is it possible to know that the enjoyment will last?

I mean, if TT actually buys that villa, being in the US might suddenly become torture. :-)

[NYCfixie]

Question for all the older guys who are feeling like they've had enough: Did the feeling that work wasn't indefinitely sustainable always exist, gradually build, come from some particular event, or have a different trajectory?

In my 40s but closer to 50.

For me, it's the irony of the workforce today. Being laid off three times for no reason (the internet meltdown days and resulting aftermath) and being told that in this day and age it is expected because we have a more flexible workforce. Then when you look for a job being told that they want someone with a more stable work history. WTF.

I work in technology and have kept my technical and leadership skills very relevant but it does not really seem to matter as jobs become super-specialized and there is still the sigma that younger is better. Looking back, I am sorry I did not go to law school or medical school similar to a few of my siblings because they never have trouble "easily" finding stable and very good paying roles.

I am glad my wife and I have been so fiscally conservative because we will be able to retire in a few years or at least scale back if we are not truly ready to 100% stop working.

[Too Tall]

Boss that Villa exists, bad news. My sis and her husband own a 500+ year old house in S. Provence where I've based cycling camps from. Worse(r) news, the adjoining building as well as many houses in the village sit unsold for bargain prices. It's all there for the adventurous. I'm quite willing to entertain the idea for a bunch of retired VsalonBums to use that for a base of operations or destination.

I'll never retire, full disclosure. I'm just doing other things.

[jclay]

Boss that Villa exists, bad news. My sis and her husband own a 500+ year old house in S. Provence where I've based cycling camps from. Worse(r) news, the adjoining building as well as many houses in the village sit unsold for bargain prices. It's all there for the adventurous. I'm quite willing to entertain the idea for a bunch of retired VsalonBums to use that for a base of operations or destination.

I'll never retire, full disclosure. I'm just doing other things.

Well, you'll need an in-house frame builder! Photos @ link in sig.

[Lionel]

Boss that Villa exists, bad news. My sis and her husband own a 500+ year old house in S. Provence where I've based cycling camps from. Worse(r) news, the adjoining building as well as many houses in the village sit unsold for bargain prices. It's all there for the adventurous. I'm quite willing to entertain the idea for a bunch of retired VsalonBums to use that for a base of operations or destination.

I'll never retire, full disclosure. I'm just doing other things.

Yeah, this part of Provence is really cheap but for most part of the year also totally dead.