great book

[SteveP]

Ive been really enjoying Mccullaghs new book on the
Wright Brothers.

Great author, love his books.

[davids]

I love you Pooch, but I didn't love that book.

[SteveP]

I love you Pooch, but I didn't love that book.

I might join facebook, friend you and then unfriend you for spite.

[ron l edmiston]

I might join facebook, friend you and then unfriend you for spite.

--- what an ole man learned so well on hastings pond years back ---- "true friendship has no boundary.."

with a memory smile and respect..,

ronnie

[davids]

I might join facebook, friend you and then unfriend you for spite.

Here's my issue with the book:

The Wright brothers were brilliant, dedicated scientists. They went off on their own, put their heads down, and solved the problems of aeronautics. Problems no one else had been able to solve. In addition to flying the first airplane, they figured out lift, invented the wing, and created the windtunnel. I mean, look up in the sky. Those planes up there right now are using the solutions that these guys figured out in a storefront, in some dunes, and above a field.

McCoullaugh shares some great stories. I think my favorite was that they were off flying at the field next to the Dayton streetcar line for, what, a year? With commuters riding by. And no one seemed to notice that they were flying.

But I wanted him to tell the story of how they figured it out. The science was missing, and that is a gaping hole at the center of their importance. I think the Smithsonian's exhibit tells that story well, btw.

[Saab2000]

A few years ago, after my father died, my mother suggested a family vacation in the Outer Banks in North Carolina. We spent a number of days there and my brother and I went to Kitty Hawk to the dunes and the museum where all this stuff took place. It's a very interesting museum and definitely worth of an afternoon if anyone gets to the Outer Banks area.

Not only were the Wright Brothers brilliant in solving the aforementioned issues, they were brave. The original Wright Flyer is a notoriously unstable machine and attempts to recreate the first flight don't go well. Airplanes got better very quickly, but the first one was little more than a manned box kit with an engine.

Anyone with any interest on this subject would be well served by a stop in Kitty Hawk, NC.

[davids]

A few years ago, after my father died, my mother suggested a family vacation in the Outer Banks in North Carolina. We spent a number of days there and my brother and I went to Kitty Hawk to the dunes and the museum where all this stuff took place. It's a very interesting museum and definitely worth of an afternoon if anyone gets to the Outer Banks area.

Not only were the Wright Brothers brilliant in solving the aforementioned issues, they were brave. The original Wright Flyer is a notoriously unstable machine and attempts to recreate the first flight don't go well. Airplanes got better very quickly, but the first one was little more than a manned box kit with an engine.

Anyone with any interest on this subject would be well served by a stop in Kitty Hawk, NC.

OK, now I'm going to compliment the book: One of the things it does well is tell the story of the steady development of their plane, from the Kitty Hawk gliders to the first flight (complete with a real-time photo of the moment, a staggering achievement), and then back to a Dayton farmer's field (the one next to the streetcar line), where they turned that "notoriously unstable" first airplane into an agile machine.

Orville and Wilbur were giants. I just wish McCullough could have explained the "how" as well as the "what".

Attachment 85635

[Saab2000]

When I refer to 'notoriously unstable' I'm referring to what's known as dynamic stability. Modern airplanes will return to level flight if pitched up or down heavily and the oscillations in pitch will diminish. The original Wright Flyer did the opposite and the pitch oscillations increase. That fact makes their achievement even greater.

Of note is that the photo above shows two propellors. But they are turned by one engine and there is a band that turns them in opposite directions with a twist in the band on one side. The museum in Kitty Hawk contains a life-size replica of the original Wright Flyer.

[SteveP]

david

he did talk about their building a wind tunnel to test the shape of the forms for lift
and a lot about the kite testing that they mastered first.

anyway,i thought it was a great book... those guys were giants.

[nrs5000]

When I refer to 'notoriously unstable' I'm referring to what's known as dynamic stability. Modern airplanes will return to level flight if pitched up or down heavily and the oscillations in pitch will diminish. The original Wright Flyer did the opposite and the pitch oscillations increase. That fact makes their achievement even greater.

Of note is that the photo above shows two propellors. But they are turned by one engine and there is a band that turns them in opposite directions with a twist in the band on one side. The museum in Kitty Hawk contains a life-size replica of the original Wright Flyer.

Saab, what kind of control surfaces did the flyer have? I'm guessing not ailerons, elevators, rudder, etc?

[Saab2000]

Saab, what kind of control surfaces did the flyer have? I'm guessing not ailerons, elevators, rudder, etc?

Wing warping. There were patents and acrimonious lawsuits involving this technology vs. ailerons.

Ailerons are used virtually universally today. I'm no expert on this. I've just read a bit online and remember the lecture at the museum. But there is clearly a rudder and an elevator on the airplane in the photo and in the video. With the exception of having the pitch-controlling elevator at the rear of the structure nowadays it's incredible how little the basic forms have changed on modern aircraft from these earliest machines.

Edit: I don't know if the rudder on the original machine was moveable or just provided stability. Today a rudder is used to coordinate a turn but is not used to initiate a turn. That's done by rolling the airplane with ailerons.

[nrs5000]

Wing warping. There were patents and acrimonious lawsuits involving this technology vs. ailerons.

Ailerons are used virtually universally today. I'm no expert on this. I've just read a bit online and remember the lecture at the museum. But there is clearly a rudder and an elevator on the airplane in the photo and in the video. With the exception of having the pitch-controlling elevator at the rear of the structure nowadays it's incredible how little the basic forms have changed on modern aircraft from these earliest machines.

Edit: I don't know if the rudder on the original machine was moveable or just provided stability. Today a rudder is used to coordinate a turn but is not used to initiate a turn. That's done by rolling the airplane with ailerons.

Cool, thanks.

[SteveP]

Edit: I don't know if the rudder on the original machine was moveable or just provided stability. Today a rudder is used to coordinate a turn but is not used to initiate a turn. That's done by rolling the airplane with ailerons.

the rudder did move on the 2nd version. it was orvilles idea. notable it was mentioned that they thought of using ailerons but instead warped the whole wings... i would be curious to know what the curvature of the wings would be compared to a simple plane today.. would be interesting how close they got ... they did go through several variations of this.

[Too Tall]

Years ago I did some reading and was especially fascinated with their engine. Made from scratch and not so bad as they say.

[TTX1]

Not for nothing, but these guys were bike builders.

<drops mic>

[SteveP]

Worlds best collectible bike woukd be a Wright Bros model.

[Saab2000]

Worlds best collectible bike woukd be a Wright Bros model.

When I was a kid we drove through Ohio and stopped there at a museum. I have pictures of their bikes but not in digital form. They had some shaft drive bikes IIRC though I may be misremembering this..... Not sure. I'd like to digitize and post some pics I have. I have many which would be relevant here at V-Salon, including Wright Bros. bike pics.