So it's jobs they want eh?

[Dallas Tex]

right
so you believe anyone that is islamic is a supporter of ISIS?

How do you get there from what I said?????

Of course not.

Not all policeman single out blacks for inquiry and are more likely to shoot a black. But denying that there may be some cultural issues with the police community that need to be addressed is silly.

[Will Neide]

How do you feel about the President saying, "...remember that during the Crusades and the Inquisition, people committed terrible deeds in the name of Christ. In our home country, slavery and Jim Crow all too often was justified in the name of Christ." ?

Some people felt he was criticizing Christianity and were quite upset.

I saw it more as a reminder that terrible things have been done in the name of, hell, pretty much every religion. And that we should be attacking those terrible things (and the people doing them) rather than the broader religion.

People are upset with those remarks because they are a false comparision. It also is a cheap shot soundbite, that neglects to represent the situation in that region at the time as well as the events that led up to the crusades. It also doesn't reflect the current state of affairs and the events happening in real time.

[davids]

No religion should be above criticism. What upset me was using things that happened 1,000 years ago as a way to excuse or rationalize horrible acts of violence and oppression that are happening today.

So you think that was intended to "excuse or rationalize" ISIS's, Al Qaeda's, etc. actions?

People are upset with those remarks because they are a false comparision. It also is a cheap shot soundbite, that neglects to represent the situation in that region at the time as well as the events that led up to the crusades. It also doesn't reflect the current state of affairs and the events happening in real time.

In what respect is comparing the Crusades with ISIS's behavior a false comparison? Both use religious doctrine to justify, and even glorify, extreme atrocities. I've got some stories about what the Crusaders did to my ancestors in case you doubt their bloodthirsty cruelty.

[edoz]

Of course the problem is Islam. These acts are are inspired by this religion, right or wrong.

Why is it so difficult for folks to criticsize a religion???

I disagree thatt he problem is Islam. ISIS is made up of evil dudes, and they are gonna be just as evil regardless of their religion.
Is there some fucked up shit in Islamic scripture? Hell yes there is, but there is much of the same fucked up shit in the Old Testament.
The thing is, people have free will. The members of ISIS can choose tto live in peace just as 99.99% of the other Muslims and Christians in the world do. "Mohammed made me do it" is a bullshit excuse.

That being said Glenn, I still love you. Just not as I love myself, IYKWIM;)

[Jonathan]

One thing is for sure. Isis will drive us to be as brutal as they are and both sides will feel morally justified doing it and eventually it will be as one vietnam vet on this forum says.."there is no right, there is no wrong, it's just who is left". I don't know that we have much choice and that's really sad. And if anyone thinks there are many in mainstream Christianity who don't think this is proof of end times prophecy you are just as naive as you claim others to be. There are many who will gladly take up this holy war with their sons leading the way. Hell, in Alabama the Chief Justice is still fighting the civil war.

[Loki]

i think you missed a big point
it's not about islam, it's about some extremists that interpret some ancient scriptures literally.
i'm not very religious so i might be wrong here, but doesn't the bible have scriptures that reference owning slaves and things women arent allowed to do so on and so forth...
does that make all catholics or christians a "problem" too?

Their are 31,173 verses in the old and new testaments, most would consider Christian doctrine coming from the new testament . If you really want a answer addressing your question, you will have to be more specific as to what "scriptures" you are referring to. Chapter and verse would be helpful.

[Will Neide]

In what respect is comparing the Crusades with ISIS's behavior a false comparison? Both use religious doctrine to justify, and even glorify, extreme atrocities. I've got some stories about what the Crusaders did to my ancestors in case you doubt their bloodthirsty cruelty.

I've got minimal interest in going down this road. It's a race to the bottom to see who can "out do" the other with stories of atrocities. I'm familiar with your stories.

[Dallas Tex]

I disagree thatt he problem is Islam. ISIS is made up of evil dudes, and they are gonna be just as evil regardless of their religion.
Is there some fucked up shit in Islamic scripture? Hell yes there is, but there is much of the same fucked up shit in the Old Testament.
The thing is, people have free will. The members of ISIS can choose tto live in peace just as 99.99% of the other Muslims and Christians in the world do. "Mohammed made me do it" is a bullshit excuse.

That being said Glenn, I still love you. Just not as I love myself, IYKWIM;)

I love you more than you love me. That's apparent.

People do what they do. There is no sort of mind control.

But there is no denying that THIS religion inspires a grossly disproportionate amount of terrorism, violence, and heinous oppression of women & gays, etc.

Take terrorism out of it. I'm not a fan simply based on its stone age views of women, gays, and religious freedoms.

[Christian Fox]

So you think that was intended to "excuse or rationalize" ISIS's, Al Qaeda's, etc. actions?



In what respect is comparing the Crusades with ISIS's behavior a false comparison? Both use religious doctrine to justify, and even glorify, extreme atrocities. I've got some stories about what the Crusaders did to my ancestors in case you doubt their bloodthirsty cruelty.

The tense of your chosen verb is the operative thing here: ISIS is using, the Crusaders used. As in, a really, really long time ago. I'm no religious scholar, but I'm pretty sure every other major religion has evolved with modern times to a large degree. At let's not forget, ISIS is just the (most flamboyantly awful) flavor of the month. Killing in the name of Islam, by lots of different groups, has been going on for a long time now during modern times.

[Will Neide]

The beauty of all this is we can still disagree with each other civilly without fear of having our heads removed.

[vertical_doug]

I disagree thatt he problem is Islam. ISIS is made up of evil dudes, and they are gonna be just as evil regardless of their religion.
Is there some fucked up shit in Islamic scripture? Hell yes there is, but there is much of the same fucked up shit in the Old Testament.
The thing is, people have free will. The members of ISIS can choose tto live in peace just as 99.99% of the other Muslims and Christians in the world do. "Mohammed made me do it" is a bullshit excuse.

Some of the problem is America views many of these issues as good vs evil, which simplifies the situation and never seems to get to the root cause.

Insanity is doing the same thing over and over again, so after 100+ years maybe America will be better off just sitting this one out. We aren't going to do your dirty bombing work, we aren't going to train your soldiers, go ahead have at it. (It is important the West doesn't give asylum to the elite of the affected countries. They have to stay too)

[Dallas Tex]

Some of the problem is America views many of these issues as good vs evil, which simplifies the situation and never seems to get to the root cause.

Insanity is doing the same thing over and over again, so after 100+ years maybe America will be better off just sitting this one out. We aren't going to do your dirty bombing work, we aren't going to train your soldiers, go ahead have at it. (It is important the West doesn't give asylum to the elite of the affected countries. They have to stay too)

No way.......because THIS time it's going to fix everything......

[Will Neide]

Some of the problem is America views many of these issues as good vs evil, which simplifies the situation and never seems to get to the root cause.

Insanity is doing the same thing over and over again, so after 100+ years maybe America will be better off just sitting this one out. We aren't going to do your dirty bombing work, we aren't going to train your soldiers, go ahead have at it. (It is important the West doesn't give asylum to the elite of the affected countries. They have to stay too)

In theory I'm with ya. Let's just get out and let them have at it. Our dependence on Saudi oil won't allow us to sit by and watch though. I'm guessing we are the Saudi guards, so to speak, and with ISIS undoubtedly eyeing up Mecca and Medina, and the Sunni Saudi army questionable in strength, the Saudi royals to a great extent rely on us as we do them. They have already requested more US support, so I think that speaks volumes. ISIS wants, no... NEEDS, to occupy those two major cities.

[mjbabcock]

I heard an interesting interview with a prison warden who noted that Islam was becoming the philosophy of the oppressed. He likened it to Marxism/Communism in the 1950's-70's. It was interesting though I've got nothing to back up the assertion.

[Nierman]

The three ISIS bottom brackets I've owned were pure evil.

[vertical_doug]

In theory I'm with ya. Let's just get out and let them have at it. Our dependence on Saudi oil won't allow us to sit by and watch though. I'm guessing we are the Saudi guards, so to speak, and with ISIS undoubtedly eyeing up Mecca and Medina, and the Sunni Saudi army questionable in strength, the Saudi royals to a great extent rely on us as we do them. They have already requested more US support, so I think that speaks volumes. ISIS wants, no... NEEDS, to occupy those two major cities.

Because of shale, our imports are declining. As of Nov 2014, we only imported 1.5mm b from that area. This is easily replaceable from non-opec, canada and domestic production. Obviously Europe, Japan and China do not have this luxury, but every war has collateral damage.

[Cookietruck]

Their are 31,173 verses in the old and new testaments, most would consider Christian doctrine coming from the new testament . If you really want a answer addressing your question, you will have to be more specific as to what "scriptures" you are referring to. Chapter and verse would be helpful.

naw, i don't really have any interest in any testament old or new.

[miwuksurfer]

Modern, religion-inspired violence around the world...

Violent Buddists- July 2014:
A Coordinated Extremist Buddhist Network Is Sowing Hatred Across Asia

Active Christian militant group:
State Dept. Spokeswoman: 'Christian Militant Group' Among 'Extremist Threats We Face' | CNS News

Extremist Jews:
Racist Jewish Group Offers Dilemma to Israel as Anti-Arab Violence Rises – Forward.com

Violent Mormon fundamentalists:
Mormon Fundamentalism and Violence: A Historical Analysis

Violent athiest:
Chapel Hill Muslim Murders Show Atheism Has Violent Extremists Too | The New Republic

The moral of the story is that you can't pigeonhole crazy.

[Cookietruck]

oh my curiosity got the better of me.

Violent passages in the Koran and the Bible - The Boston Globe

once again, this isn't a problem with religion.

could it be somewhat political and have something to do with destabilization and western influence?

[Dallas Tex]

Modern, religion-inspired violence around the world...

Violent Buddists- July 2014:
A Coordinated Extremist Buddhist Network Is Sowing Hatred Across Asia

Active Christian militant group:
State Dept. Spokeswoman: 'Christian Militant Group' Among 'Extremist Threats We Face' | CNS News

Extremist Jews:
Racist Jewish Group Offers Dilemma to Israel as Anti-Arab Violence Rises – Forward.com

Violent Mormon fundamentalists:
Mormon Fundamentalism and Violence: A Historical Analysis

Violent athiest:
Chapel Hill Muslim Murders Show Atheism Has Violent Extremists Too | The New Republic

The moral of the story is that you can't pigeonhole crazy.

It's wholly and unequivocally intellectually dishonest to draw a moral equivalency between these statistically invisible events and the ongoing, organized, well financed onslaught of Islamic terrorism.