Messer Starlight 1302 Torch Handle

[Doug Fattic]

From Mark Stonich's chart that Dave posted a link to, I see that the Messer tip #2 is .742mm in diameter and tip #3 is 1.181mm. That might not seem like much but is actually quite a spread in-between tip sizes. The #2 is smaller than what I use and the #3 bigger (except for when using propane). Most beginners have trouble with a big tip because it heats up material faster than then can figure out what is going on and how to compensate. It is usually easier to start out with a smaller flame so things happen slower. When things become more automatic then they can increase tip size. Pros like to get in and out fast with bigger tips. If you took a poll of tip sizes commonly used by hobbyists and pros, you would find a wide variation of preferences.

So the challenge for a learner doing a practice lug with a small tip is that their flame pattern has to be more precise to cover the area where silver is to go more evenly. A typical beginner mistake is to kind of overheat one small area and not heat up another enough so the silver won't flow through evenly because of an inconsistent flame pattern. On the other hand a bigger flame provides more even heat (especially if it is held a bit further back) but requires more instant corrective motions. Often times in the beginning too much heat and too slow of a reaction makes a mess. A bigger tip also makes it more difficult to clean the shorelines so extra silver isn't poking out where it doesn't belong. It still makes sense to start practicing with a smaller tip like the Messer #2.

You didn't indicate if you were using propane or acetylene? That makes a difference in what size tip to recommend. Because propane produces a cooler flame it requires a bigger tip size. It also makes it easier for beginners because it takes longer to heat up a joint and they have more time to get it. It appears that this Messer torch can have different mixer connectors so you can attach almost any brand of mixer/tips to the handle? Then you can go to a more intermediate size tip than the Messer #3.

[JFW]

I believe the Messer is an injector type torch. This has been discussed on the framebuilders list quite recently. Search it up.

Truls

[dbohemian]

I believe the Messer is an injector type torch. This has been discussed on the framebuilders list quite recently. Search it up.

Truls

Yes, please look it up. If the Messer is an injector style, I would skip it.....I really don't feel the injector styles are as good as the equal pressure types. It may not be too hard to just make a big order from the U.S.A. I know the shipping is horrendous but if you get guages, lightweight hoses, body and tips it may work out better for you.

[Kumo Cycles]

Make sure you double check the threads on the oxy and fuel lines when buying from the US.

When I looked into buying a torch from the US I noticed that the connector for the Oxy line had a different thread than Aussie lines, and thus Aussie Oxy bottles.

Easy enough to change I imagine, but a trap for the unwary

Yes, please look it up. If the Messer is an injector style, I would skip it.....I really don't feel the injector styles are as good as the equal pressure types. It may not be too hard to just make a big order from the U.S.A. I know the shipping is horrendous but if you get guages, lightweight hoses, body and tips it may work out better for you.

[bencooper]

I've found the same the with my Midget - the fittings and hoses are only identified as A and B sized, and the B size is a couple of mm smaller than the 3/8" BSP that's standard in the UK (and I think most of the world). Managed to bodge it, but I've not yet worked out how to get my economiser connected in.

[NickyD]

Great replies guys, I think I've decided on the Harris handle as shown below. Not sure which model yet the salesman will come and visit next month and let me have a look at them. I actually made a mistake saying it was the 1302 Messer handle that I'd tried, it was actually the mini thermMiniTherm.png which although you can get large ish tips for it, I think is too small for allround use and the tips are a special type so will be expensive. Gorgeous build quality though and I guess it would be great for braze ons so maybe as a second torch in the future it might be an option. It was over a year ago in Auckland that I tried it and missed it in the on-line brochure.


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[Kumo Cycles]

Harris handle bottom right is the one that I use.

Wouldn't change it for the world