Richard Sachs Cycles

[Eric Estlund]

I'm not talking protour. I understand that citizen-x want's what the big boy's riding, but I'm limiting my question (at the moment) to the racing that happens below the top level. Sponsoring a pro team seems out of the reach of most single operator shops.

[Dave Anderson]

Interesting thread.....it goes up, down, and around. I think that one of the main points here is that the show has evolved, as all things tend to do, and what that means....Has it been for the good or the bad? Who is to say. Some good...some bad IMO. But it is what it is and I enjoyed the show (not the 2000 mile drive, though, mind you) and have signed up for next year already (at 5:02 PM...right behind e-richie...man I hate lines! :-) JK) People will bring what they bring, its as simple as that. For some, this is the one best chance to make a mark and they are going to do what they think is best to get attention....others will simply bring what they build day in and day out.... but at the end of the day its all good. They are all bikes after all and who doesn't love that?

Dave

PS: I would like to extend a BIG thank you to Ben, Bill, and Ernest for allowing me to bring their bikes to the show! Its was very nice of them to allow me to show them to thousands before they've had a chance to see them themselves.

[e-RICHIE]

I'm not talking protour. I understand that citizen-x want's what the big boy's riding, but I'm limiting my question (at the moment) to the racing that happens below the top level. Sponsoring a pro team seems out of the reach of most single operator shops.

This ^ ^ I agree with. But I'll add that a commitment at any level (two riders, an extended year deal with four riders, etc) will pay dividends to beat the band. Just like print ads, if you do it once "just to see what happens..." it's a donation. If you sign up for frequency insertion rates and make the investment a true commitment, it will be better than sex - unless of course, it's sex with the Shamrock Shaker atmo.

Seriously, we all need a target and a long term goal. I found mine in racing only because I have been pinning on numbers long before I knew what silver brazing was. Something should be speaking to all of us if we want this effbuilding thang to be sustainable. B4PAs (bicycles for public adoration) will only take us so far. No, I don't a maker in mind when I say shit like this; it's a residual feeling I get when I ponder where the last eight years has delivered this niche to.

[blasdelf]

People make and sell the oddball stuff because the bigger industry does not. Criticizing a builder for showing a weird custom bike always strikes me as odd. The "weird" part is the reason a custom builder was sought out and commissioned in the first place.

The problem is that a lot of exhibitors are clearly either unwilling to correct the customer or simply have no idea how to design the type of bike the customer is asking for.

You see stuff like road bikes with "my first sweet fixie" fits, shoved forward leather saddles, inept brake placements, fake porteurs with high-flop geo and wiggly aftermarket racks. Stuff that shows that the exhibitor doesn't care about it as a rideable vehicle.

[e-RICHIE]

The problem is <cut>

Were you there? I missed a chance to jump you and get this saxual tension thing fixed atmo.

[Tom Officer]

My thoughts on this were about how you guys get back to being relevant in the racing scene. I understand the pro tour stuff is out of the question, but local and regional teams seem doable. I can tell from my perspective that I was always influenced by what I saw fast guys riding and still am. Given that the performance difference is negligible between steel and the mass produced stuff, don't see why more of you aren't doing what Richie does.

I used to tease him a few years ago about why he didn't get together with some of his steel buddies and get a really good road team going! Just a thought as I'd love nothing more than to see the relevance return.

[Gregory Townsend]

I flew up Sunday with the missus and cash. I had two real goals in mind, I wanted to say hello to as many as possible and I wanted to buy things. I'm a customer of those that sell the stuff I need to make frames and was looking to see what's new.
We had a great time seeing and talking to as many as possible but missed a few. I tried to say hello to Richie, Tim O'Donnell and a few others but they were always busy, so we had to move on.

I too was really impressed with Paul Sadoff's booth. It was cool to see the older, well used bikes and the description of each one.
Hopefully I can get more time next year.

BTW
I can also be included in those that support racing, even though it's only cross. I can't compete with the big guys but do give cash & time to local racing.

[maunahaole]

Hey Richie - you are giving us gold here. But what the hell? You are in SF and have some time away from the bench and the mountaintop with TLD. Go enjoy yourself around the town. There's a lot to take in.

[Adam Eldridge]

1. Builders bring the next bike in their queue.

2. The bike is raw.

Problem solved. Wait. Then NAHBS wouldn't exist.

Im down for bro chillin' and talkin' shop with the masters over a whiskey neat at a NAHBS type event. However, I get the impression that most of the elders are insular. I dont know why. Pass the torch guys! I want to hear about your experience.

All the awards encourage ostentatious 15K retail bicycles.

Growing up I drooled over the 64 SS 409 Tri Power. Practical. Nope. Cool as shi*? Yep.

Can you take a Sora or 105 bike with steel 27in wheels to the show and get attention?

Do Frame builders charge this much per hour?

Dyrwallers- $110
Electrician $140
Hardwood floor instaler, entire floor $100, small repair $250
Independent auto mech $85
Dealership auto mech $100
Diesel mech $125
Paralegal $175

Doubt it? Should they? Hell yes if they want to be involved in a sustainable business. So when I see posts like "selling at a loss - 2800" "to recoup NAHBS expenditure" it makes me want to cringe.

Maybe they're knocking the frame out in record quickness with precision? Doubt it. Maybe they're a Millionaire. I dont know.

I cant really see the point in NAHBS unless you take a pre-sold ride.

Refer back to the top. I'd love to bro chill but im not flush with cash. We're always one step in front of the sheriff. We're young. We're working on business processes and the queue. We cant afford to take what the public wants to see at NAHBS.

As a frame builder do you go to NAHBS to become official?

Selling at a loss for exposure to 8K people walking through is not my idea of a sound decision (at this point).

Over and Out. Back in the hole. Painting today.

[cody.wms]

Selling at a loss for exposure to 8K people walking through is not my idea of a sound decision (at this point).

I'm not a builder, just a guy that likes to ride and occasionally buy these things. The only real thing I can comment on in your post is this ^^. The "viewership" of NAHBS goes well beyond who walks in the door. The photothread in the subforum here has almost 5K views. The one at Paceline has 3.3K views right now. I see blurry unfocused pictures on Flickr with hundreds of views. No telling how many views John Prolly, Urban Velo, Momentum, and others get from NAHBS coverage. All of these people are potential customers you are getting your stuff in front of if you exhibit. Whether it is worth it for a builder to spend the $$ to get there, well, that is a question each builder has to answer, but who you can reach goes well beyond who walks in the door.

[conorb]

Actually, I think more builders support racing than you might first think. Few are as high profile as Richard's team but they are out there. Don Walker, Spooky, Zancanato, me, etc.

It's always a balance but we support those that we can and I would like to do more.



Conor

[blasdelf]

Were you there? I missed a chance to jump you and get this saxual tension thing fixed atmo.

nope

maybe some time in the future

with a chaperone

[randonneur]

I get the impression that most of the elders are insular.

A lot to talk about in this thread, but just wanted first to spit out my take on the above.

I spent my SAC weekend in a lot of seminars, and slowly and repeatedly walking up and down the aisles chatting with folks, and I have to say; I got the complete opposite impression. All of the seminar speakers appeared to me to be humble almost to a fault and eager to share their knowledge, even if the too-short seminar slots made it difficult to cover everything they wanted to.

[Dorman]

A lot to talk about in this thread, but just wanted first to spit out my take on the above.

I spent my SAC weekend in a lot of seminars, and slowly and repeatedly walking up and down the aisles chatting with folks, and I have to say; I got the complete opposite impression. All of the seminar speakers appeared to me to be humble almost to a fault and eager to share their knowledge, even if the too-short seminar slots made it difficult to cover everything they wanted to.

Online personnas do not a real person make. No matter how hard you try.

[e-RICHIE]

Full text here -

http://www.cxmagazine.com/nahbs-2012...-dan-timmerman

[e-RICHIE]

Full text here -

http://www.cxmagazine.com/nahbs-2012...-dan-timmerman

[the bottle ride]

Looking forward to seeing Dan back in action.

[e-RICHIE]

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text -

Stuck In The Middle | RICHARD SACHS CYCLES

source -

ATMO Bis | RICHARD SACHS CYCLES


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[Lionel]

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text -

Stuck In The Middle | RICHARD SACHS CYCLES

source -

ATMO Bis | RICHARD SACHS CYCLES


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3 months, that's a pretty big break. Glad to hear you were still able to pedal after that ;)

[WayneJ]

The bike is ALWAYS ready - even if the race is cancelled.