Impeachment of Trump, Part Deux

[jclay]

Snippets from CNN this afternoon: House Democrats are planning to introduce an impeachment resolution on Monday, a move that would allow Democrats to fast-track an impeachment vote next week, though Democrats have not committed yet to holding such a vote. The latest draft of the impeachment resolution, obtained by CNN, includes one article of impeachment for "incitement of insurrection."

House Intelligence Chairman Adam Schiff, a California Democrat who led the impeachment probe in 2019, made clear to his caucus the realities of moving ahead with impeachment now and the potential pitfalls. His concern: the precedent of fast-tracking an impeachment and the perception that House Democrats were attempting to protect Biden by trying to prevent Trump from running again, according to multiple sources on call."

From me: I call bullshit; what he's worried about has already been bought; it is a sunk cost. The perceptions of Trumpians have long been the turd at the bottom of the toilet; it can't go any lower and it doesn't matter if it could. This event requires an iron fisted response and one essential element of it is to grow the backbone to ram impeachment through with alacrity.

Folks need to be ringing their representative's phones, as well as Mr. Schiff's, off the hook to make the point clear.

[Mabouya]

As much as I agree that Trump should be made to pay a price for his anti-democratic behavior (finally!) IMO it's like throwing a player out of a game with 2 seconds left on the clock, something with marginal utility.

Personally, I think time and effort would be much better spent on shoring up the electoral process, and make it way more difficult to votes to be ignored. Where would we be if Republican officials in places like GA had not stood up to Trump? THAT's what needs to be fixed.

[gregl]

As much as I agree that Trump should be made to pay a price for his anti-democratic behavior (finally!) IMO it's like throwing a player out of a game with 2 seconds left on the clock, something with marginal utility.

Personally, I think time and effort would be much better spent on shoring up the electoral process, and make it way more difficult to votes to be ignored. Where would we be if Republican officials in places like GA had not stood up to Trump? THAT's what needs to be fixed.

The utility of successfully impeaching Trump is that he could never run for President again. It would reinforce our Governmental policy as set forth in the Constitution and act as a deterrent for future wannabe dictators. If a player makes a flagrant foul with 2 seconds left, you still need to eject them from the game. Agreed that the rest of the electoral process needs strengthening. Let's start with elimination of gerrymandering and getting Citizens United overturned!

Greg

[Mark Kelly]

The disqualification vote is separate from the conviction vote.

I thought it had less chance of success as it also required a 2/3 majority but it turns out it only requires a simple majority according to Justia.

[theflashunc]

There also needs to be clear precedent set that even if the clock runs out, an insurrection attempt by a President against the government is met with an immediate response.

To not do so is a complete abdication of responsibility.

[72gmc]

I’ve read that even if the removal from office vote is made moot by the end of his term, the disqualification vote can still be held. That is a very good reason to proceed.

[ides1056]

Additionally:

He loses his pension and all financial benefits.

He loses Secret Service protection.

He is no longer privy to intelligence briefings.

These are good enough reasons to go through with it.

[robin3mj]

Not to mention the oh so minor fact that all of the Congress and the VP had to shelter in place in their workplace due to the actions of the POTUS. And not responding to that sets a ridiculously awful precedent for US democracy as a whole.
Where’s the tipping point? One dead cop is OK, but if they’d managed to punch a Congressman, THAT would have been over the line?

I can’t believe the call to Raffensberger was only a week ago.

[OnTheEllipse]

Not to mention the oh so minor fact that all of the Congress and the VP had to shelter in place in their workplace due to the actions of the POTUS. And not responding to that sets a ridiculously awful precedent for US democracy as a whole.
Where’s the tipping point? One dead cop is OK, but if they’d managed to punch a Congressman, THAT would have been over the line?

I can’t believe the call to Raffensberger was only a week ago.

I thought that when Congress reconvened, after the attempt on their lives, every single one of them would change their vote, join in song like after 9/11 and not leave until Trump was escorted out. How naive of me. The fact that any less happened is sheer madness. The fact that they went back in and doubled down has me concerned about the stability of the country.

If the confederates had access to a plane, is there any doubt they would have tried to fly it into the Capitol instead? The GOP is a terrorist orginazation.

[sine]

There also needs to be clear precedent set that even if the clock runs out, an insurrection attempt by a President against the government is met with an immediate response.

To not do so is a complete abdication of responsibility.

I agree with this. This bloke needs to go away.....politically.

[ides1056]

He's a crass act: hasn't lowered the flag for the officer who was killed or contacted his family.

https://www.nytimes.com/2021/01/09/u...gtype=Homepage

[Mark Walberg]

Isn't the penalty for treason still death?

[claritycycler]

I believe treason is aiding a foreign country/power against the US, if anything trump's actions are worse.

[Mark Walberg]

I see that treason is limited to aiding a power that is at war with the US.

Looks like this is more appropriate:

§2383. Rebellion or insurrection

Whoever incites, sets on foot, assists, or engages in any rebellion or insurrection against the authority of the United States or the laws thereof, or gives aid or comfort thereto, shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than ten years, or both; and shall be incapable of holding any office under the United States.

(June 25, 1948, ch. 645, 62 Stat. 808; Pub. L. 103–322, title XXXIII, §330016(1)(L), Sept. 13, 1994, 108 Stat. 2147.)

[Caleb Evenson]

I spent much time watching videos and reading corresponding comments on BitChute last night. People believe a supercomputer changed 3% of the votes from Trump's favor to Biden's favor, and that Trump need only declassify "Hammer and Scorecard" for proof. They believe two marches on the Capitol occurred - the one that reached the Capitol consisted mostly of Antifa and BLM members acting as imposters of patriots, while the other consisted wholly of Trump supporters. According to an open letter from the Nye County, NV GOP Chairman, Trump didn't incite any violence, and suggested people march on the Capital, then delayed his departure so that he could identify the traitors among his supporters. According to that same letter, he will get a second term and Biden will not be president. Some commenters believe the US is now communist (what a swift and somehow relatively peaceful change!). They also believe Pence, who Trump now knows is a traitor, has murdered around 50 children by choking them while raping them. And a common thread through it all is "The Purge" - Twitter, YouTube, etc de-platforming Those Who Tell the Truth.

I therefore agree with those who promote a swift and harsh response to January 6th, because most of those who perpetuated the incitement and agree with it appear largely unable to challenge anything they believe, and any other precedent is likely to embolden them on their crusade to save the Real America from Satanists running Totalitarian, Censorious America.

[jimcav]

It is hard to imagine being the analysts that must sift through crap like that. It should be just ridiculous, and indicate the need for mental health services, but instead it has become deadly serious. To think that instead of having foreign enemies driving this crazy stuff, we now have our own fellow citizens doing it.

[gregl]

I see that treason is limited to aiding a power that is at war with the US.

Looks like this is more appropriate:

§2383. Rebellion or insurrection

Whoever incites, sets on foot, assists, or engages in any rebellion or insurrection against the authority of the United States or the laws thereof, or gives aid or comfort thereto, shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than ten years, or both; and shall be incapable of holding any office under the United States.

(June 25, 1948, ch. 645, 62 Stat. 808; Pub. L. 103–322, title XXXIII, §330016(1)(L), Sept. 13, 1994, 108 Stat. 2147.)

Thanks for the reference! Based on your cite, I looked up the law myself. I just sent this to my congressman:

“Congressman Katko, as a former federal prosecutor, you are undoubtedly aware of 18 U.S. Code § 2383 - Rebellion or Insurrection. Please immediately bring forth a statement to the House of Representatives that you endorse bringing up charges against President Trump on grounds of violating this law. Failure to do so makes you complicit in the Capitol insurrection of January 6, 2021. I make this request as a registered Republican voter in your district. Thank you.”

Greg

[OnTheEllipse]

I spent much time watching videos and reading corresponding comments on BitChute last night. People believe a supercomputer changed 3% of the votes from Trump's favor to Biden's favor, and that Trump need only declassify "Hammer and Scorecard" for proof. They believe two marches on the Capitol occurred - the one that reached the Capitol consisted mostly of Antifa and BLM members acting as imposters of patriots, while the other consisted wholly of Trump supporters. According to an open letter from the Nye County, NV GOP Chairman, Trump didn't incite any violence, and suggested people march on the Capital, then delayed his departure so that he could identify the traitors among his supporters. According to that same letter, he will get a second term and Biden will not be president. Some commenters believe the US is now communist (what a swift and somehow relatively peaceful change!). They also believe Pence, who Trump now knows is a traitor, has murdered around 50 children by choking them while raping them. And a common thread through it all is "The Purge" - Twitter, YouTube, etc de-platforming Those Who Tell the Truth.

I therefore agree with those who promote a swift and harsh response to January 6th, because most of those who perpetuated the incitement and agree with it appear largely unable to challenge anything they believe, and any other precedent is likely to embolden them on their crusade to save the Real America from Satanists running Totalitarian, Censorious America.

jeez.

it feels weird to even respond to their delusions, but it seems like someone has to if there's going to be an end to this.

the most worrying part of all of this is the gullibility of such a large segment of the population. so they believe that Ted Cruz stole the Iowa primary through fraud? That pedophile Hillary Clinton rigged the 2016 election that he won? And now this?

What bizarre lack of character judgement is this? I simply can't wrap my mind around it. It's not like he's "one of them".

[vertical_doug]

The protest needed a rebranding, and a Trump loyalist in DoD helped. That was a first amendment protest. Trump just cleverly tricked big tech in to showing their true motives to restrict his first amendment rights.


https://media.defense.gov/2021/Jan/0...lNrVJKn5N7N_bU

[colker]

How hard and fast can the new US AG bite Trump and his bunch?