The Business End of Things

[Mark Kelly]

The has risen out of several recent threads but I'm just going to launch and talk about that later.

I'd like us to talk about the challenges of bicyclemaking as a business. Opinions can range from "Just work at the bench for thirty years and you'll know whats right ATMO" to "I've come to this from completely out of left field having never been involved in this trade but I believe I understand business and I think I have something to offer".

In case you can't guess, I'm the second of these. Once this vintage is over I intend to try to make the transition to bicyclemaking as a business, you'll be able to watch me crash and burn as it happens on my upcoming Smoked Out thread.

To open the discussion with something positive:

In my opinion, the most important question any small business wannabe needs to answer is "Why me?" as in "What will I be offering that would make a customer choose me over the abundance of alternatives?"

Feel free to disagree with, posit alternatives to or illustrate my point.

Your time starts now.

[e-RICHIE]

The has risen out of several recent threads but I'm just going to launch and talk about that later.

I'd like us to talk about the challenges of bicyclemaking as a business. Opinions can range from "Just work at the bench for thirty years and you'll know whats right ATMO" to "I've come to this from completely out of left field having never been involved in this trade but I believe I understand business and I think I have something to offer".

In case you can't guess, I'm the second of these. Once this vintage is over I intend to try to make the transition to bicyclemaking as a business, you'll be able to watch me crash and burn as it happens on my upcoming Smoked Out thread.

To open the discussion with something positive:

In my opinion, the most important question any small business wannabe needs to answer is "Why me?" as in "What will I be offering that would make a customer choose me over the abundance of alternatives?"

Feel free to disagree with, posit alternatives to or illustrate my point.

Your time starts now.

The why me question has value assuming you are trained, skilled, and have some experience. It also helps to know where the product fits into the larger picture. A sense of history, and respect for it, would be an asset.

[Mark Kelly]

And I hope the answer to that question will come out of the smoked out thread or similar discussions, rather than here, which I wanted to be about what needs to be considered.

The ATMO was meant to be a gentle dig, Richard. Anyone who has any interest in this field knows, or at least ought to know, who you are and what you've done.

If I've given offence I apologise, but in a way your response illustrates my point: trained in what? skilled in what? have some experience in what?

Amongst other things I trained as an aeronautical engineer. Amongst other things I have skills in designing and making specialist audio electronics. Amongst other things I have experience in a business developing my IP in the process technology field and as manager / winemaker for small high end wineries.

Are these things transferrable to bikes? We'll see.

[e-RICHIE]

Not a worry.

[crumpton]

the most important question any small business wannabe needs to answer is "Why me?" as in "What will I be offering that would make a customer choose me over the abundance of alternatives?"

Feel free to disagree with, posit alternatives to or illustrate my point.

that question gets answered by the abundant far more important questions that haven't been asked. but does come with 30 or even 3 years at the bench. the question you asked is an academic marketing exorcise IMO.

[Mark Kelly]

Ok, so what, for you, are these abundant far more important questions?

BTW I agree that that question can be merely an academic marketing exercise, but the answer shouldn't be if it is to have any worth. It should reflect what drove you into doing this in the first place.

One of my favourite quotes is from Dame Gillian Weir, the great NZ organist when someone said they were thinking of going into music: "If you are thinking you might do it, don't. Only do it if you can't think of yourself as anything else"

[crumpton]

i'm still answering them for myself and mine are not yours are not mine.

i dont think my answer is that far off from your fav quote down there. diff but similar. if you are here for help to answering that for yourself then you may be asking the wrong question.

i'm not trying to be a smart ass but your approach seems a bit philosophical.

Ok, so what, for you, are these abundant far more important questions?

BTW I agree that that question can be merely an academic marketing exercise, but the answer shouldn't be if it is to have any worth. It should reflect what drove you into doing this in the first place.

One of my favourite quotes is from Dame Gillian Weir, the great NZ organist when someone said they were thinking of going into music: "If you are thinking you might do it, don't. Only do it if you can't think of yourself as anything else"

[Mark Kelly]

No, I'm not here for help, I'm here because I'm at the other end of the spectrum from the likes of Richard and Dario and I feel that the conversation here tends to lean a bit much to their point of view. This is to be expected: they are stand-out representatives of what many others would like to achieve and we can all learn something from them, including me. What we can't do is replicate the thirty years at the bench.

One of the threads that predicated this one is Stijl Cycles Smoked Out. I love "making since before maker was cool" and I appreciate the sense in having a business thread restricted to those who are already established, but I also think it's a worthwhile topic for those who aren't (yet).

This thread isn't meant to be about me, except in the sense that I'm prepared to advocate a point of view that is very different from many others'. For instance, I would genuinely love to hear a few of the smaller questions you feel are relevant to you. I then hope that those of us just starting out can work out what's relevant to us.

BTW to me "a bit philosophical" is not an insult. Amongst other things I trained in Philosophy, my field of interest was the intersection between formal logic, the philosophy of natural language and cognitive neurophysiology. I was all set to do a PhD in this but I worked out that the only jobs available were teaching philosophy.

[e-RICHIE]

I have a question for anyone who is on the far left hand side of the evolution timeline and who wants to be a framebuilder. I going to define the term as tradesman who takes money for his wares. The question is this: What is the #@/?ing rush to get to the market atmo?

[crumpton]

No, I'm not here for help, I'm here because I'm at the other end of the spectrum from the likes of Richard and Dario and I feel that the conversation here tends to lean a bit much to their point of view. This is to be expected: they are stand-out representatives of what many others would like to achieve and we can all learn something from them, including me. What we can't do is replicate the thirty years at the bench.

One of the threads that predicated this one is Stijl Cycles Smoked Out. I love "making since before maker was cool" and I appreciate the sense in having a business thread restricted to those who are already established, but I also think it's a worthwhile topic for those who aren't (yet).

This thread isn't meant to be about me, except in the sense that I'm prepared to advocate a point of view that is very different from many others'. For instance, I would genuinely love to hear a few of the smaller questions you feel are relevant to you. I then hope that those of us just starting out can work out what's relevant to us.

BTW to me "a bit philosophical" is not an insult. Amongst other things I trained in Philosophy, my field of interest was the intersection between formal logic, the philosophy of natural language and cognitive neurophysiology. I was all set to do a PhD in this but I worked out that the only jobs available were teaching philosophy.

sorry, i got hung up on the "why me" part. i'll let the likes of Dario and RS help you with the rest. i've got lights to keep on.

[Will Neide]

The has risen out of several recent threads but I'm just going to launch and talk about that later.

I think the "business end of things" is the "later" part. The current thread would be more akin to the philosophy or self reflection end of things.

I'd be interested in thoughts on the "later" part, or business end. The questions in Stijl's thread are good ones.

I think the "why me" are good topics for Smoked Out threads (which I read every one from start to finish.)

[cardinal-creative]

6 things you didn’t know about FBM | FBM Bike Co.[/url]

The FBM story fits well into this discussion.

https://vimeo.com/18094237