Michael Sam and being gay in the NFL

[tele]

This is the best commentary I have seen/read about the ridiculousness of being gay in the NFL, from Texas no less:

[Christian Fox]

Brilliant^^. Michael Sam is a brave kid. It's a big deal. It will be a circus around him for a while and he's going to take some shit, then after a while...no one will care. Which is of course is the perfect result, and will make it infinitely easier for the next gay kid to come out.

[jitahs]

Way more brave than Jason Collins coming out while going out.

[GonaSovereign]

And I'd like nothing more than to see Michael Sam drafted first round by the Kansas City Chiefs.

[christian]

Nicely put.

[ABiCi]

Way more brave than Jason Collins coming out while going out.

I don't think this is a particularly fair or useful comment to make.

[Too Tall]

I don't think this is a particularly fair or useful comment to make.

Agreed. I'm guilty of this sort flip comment time to time myself and did so because I'm impatience and expect more from public figures especially in this case.

He is a strong man and will make a positive difference.

[HorsCat]

Chapeau to Mr. Hansen for that. In the beginning I thought it'd be more of the same conservaphobia but he sure proved me wrong. Hopefully it gets lots and lots of airtime. I bet there are many texans plenty pissed at him.

[jitahs]

Agreed. I'm guilty of this sort flip comment time to time myself and did so because I'm impatience and expect more from public figures especially in this case.

He is a strong man and will make a positive difference.

I gave him props on a sliding scale vs. Collins - how is it that we disagree?

[jitahs]

I don't think this is a particularly fair or useful comment to make.

I disagree. See my comments in the Collins thread, which I believe you didn't participate in.

Fair? Definitely is. Collins is out of a job due to lack of talent/age, his peer group is longer a bunch of jocks, he's now working out looking for work for the playoff run. Taking a gentle poke at him while propping Sam I would say is the opposite of unfair. Just because two guys are gay doesn't give them equal standing in the bravery department.

Football has an entirely different subculture and one's sexuality is more strictly defined, the level of Sam's scrutiny in the locker room and in the public will be much more intense.

You could make the argument Collins help pave the way, but my gay friends have long rolled their eyes at the Johnny-come-latelies, having been out for decades. They're the brave ones, trying to be accepted in a traditional workplace, not someone who's left it.

When to come out has been a divisive issue for gays since the days of Harvey Milk. It's a personal choice and everyone has their own tolerance limit. I truly don't see how my viewpoint is unfair (when it's actually the popular sentiment among my friends) nor not useful, it only reflects my personal experience with a very large sample size. Look I've worked in the arts in SF for decades, I don't expect anyone here to understand but type I must.

Your personal experiences and viewpoints may be influenced by your peer groups and media far more than you may think.

[ABiCi]

I disagree. See my comments in the Collins thread, which I believe you didn't participate in.

Fair? Definitely is. Collins is out of a job due to lack of talent/age, his peer group is longer a bunch of jocks, he's now working out looking for work for the playoff run. Taking a gentle poke at him while propping Sam I would say is the opposite of unfair. Just because two guys are gay doesn't give them equal standing in the bravery department.

Football has an entirely different subculture and one's sexuality is more strictly defined, the level of Sam's scrutiny in the locker room and in the public will be much more intense.

You could make the argument Collins help pave the way, but my gay friends have long rolled their eyes at the Johnny-come-latelies, having been out for decades. They're the brave ones, trying to be accepted in a traditional workplace, not someone who's left it.

When to come out has been a divisive issue for gays since the days of Harvey Milk. It's a personal choice and everyone has their own tolerance limit. I truly don't see how my viewpoint is unfair (when it's actually the popular sentiment among my friends) nor not useful, it only reflects my personal experience with a very large sample size. Look I've worked in the arts in SF for decades, I don't expect anyone here to understand but type I must.

Your personal experiences and viewpoints may be influenced by your peer groups and media far more than you may think.

To come out requires bravery no matter who you are or in what circumstances you are in.

Sure, there is a scale of bravery, but these guys, or anyone else that comes out for that matter, are so far down one end of the spectrum that I don't see much point making distinctions between them and I think it is counterproductive to criticise or downplay the bravery of anyone that makes the decision to come out. It is easier now than it has been before, but it is still very hard.

Collins can only come out for himself, Sam can only come out for himself. It is unfair to criticise or trivialise one man's decision because of the nature of the other's, and that is definitely how it came across when you said one was "way more" brave.

Both of them should be applauded for their courage. I guess my problem was that it seemed like in order to praise Sam for his bravery you had to knock Collins for lacking it, or at least not demonstrating enough. I don't think that is the kind of message we want to be sent out to people who are in the position of making the decision to come out themselves.

[Dallas Tex]

, from Texas no less:

From what I've seen, Texas is far more accepting and supportive of this community than most other places around the country.

[tele]

From what I've seen, Texas is far more accepting and supportive of this community than most other places around the country.

A gay close relative of mine lived in DFW for a few years and said it was the most un-gay-friendly place he has ever lived. This was during the 90s so maybe its better now?

[joosttx]

This is the best commentary I have seen/read about the ridiculousness of being gay in the NFL, from Texas no less:

An assumption given Texas' uber conservative bent. I could be wrong, of course, and no aspersions intended against any texans not so inclined. For better or worse, I can't help but think of Bush II and Slick Rick whenever I hear the word "Texas."

Dale Hansen is a man among boys. He has been a fixture in Dallas sports since I was a wee lad. He has always been an outspoken defender of people, persons and humanity. Nice to see the fella still has the wits to articulate and the balls say it.

This is the Texas I know and was raised in. Feeling proud.