Kirk Frameworks

[Dave Kirk]

OK - here you go.

It works like this -

* cut your head tube to length and place it in the upper and lower clamps.
* set ALL four center to center distances for all tubes, including head tube, and lock down the pinch bolts.
* clamp BB onto post on plate and clamp the head tube and seat tube into V blocks (V blocks hold tube centers 2.500" off plate)
* adjust top tube to seat tube angle and lock down slide.
* clamp seat tube V block to plate (not shown).
* double check head angle and clamp head tube V block to plate (again, not shown)
* measure from top of head tube down to edge of head tube V block and make a note.
* now remove the whole deal from the clamps and plate. Take the head tube out of the faux frame and clamp back into V block at the correct elevation.
* Put actual BB shell to be used onto post and miter seat tube. Place seat tube in V block and clamp in place.
* now miter top tube and down tube and slip in place.
* call it a day and go for a ride - you've worked long enough.

The beauty of the system is it's accuracy. It is by far the most accurate set up I've ever used. It's also so cheap it's nearly free. The downside is that it's slow to set up.

I built a good 100 bikes or so on this deal and it kicked ass. I eventually got an Anvil to save time but this stays around just in case. I encourage you to take the idea and run with it.

Let me know how it goes.

dave

[geoffk]

How cool is that? I think that is indeed the same bike. What event did you do?

Dave

It was the first running of the Mead Roubaix, this year's stand-in for the old Boulder Roubaix. Lots of photos at that link, as well as this one.

[timdude]

Thanks Dave, the paint work is stunning. My painting buddy does very good work, mostly vintage guitar paint restoration for the local shops in town. I'll post a pic when it's done.

Thanks again!
Tim

[Dave Kirk]

It was the first running of the Mead Roubaix, this year's stand-in for the old Boulder Roubaix. Lots of photos at that link, as well as this one.

That looks like good fun. How did it go?

dave

[Dave Kirk]

Thanks Dave, the paint work is stunning. My painting buddy does very good work, mostly vintage guitar paint restoration for the local shops in town. I'll post a pic when it's done.

Thanks again!
Tim

Guitar guys often do very good work. I look forward to seeing what he comes up with.

Dave

[Jayme]

OK - here you go.

It works like this -

* cut your head tube to length and place it in the upper and lower clamps.
* set ALL four center to center distances for all tubes, including head tube, and lock down the pinch bolts.
* clamp BB onto post on plate and clamp the head tube and seat tube into V blocks (V blocks hold tube centers 2.500" off plate)
* adjust top tube to seat tube angle and lock down slide.
* clamp seat tube V block to plate (not shown).
* double check head angle and clamp head tube V block to plate (again, not shown)
* measure from top of head tube down to edge of head tube V block and make a note.
* now remove the whole deal from the clamps and plate. Take the head tube out of the faux frame and clamp back into V block at the correct elevation.
* Put actual BB shell to be used onto post and miter seat tube. Place seat tube in V block and clamp in place.
* now miter top tube and down tube and slip in place.
* call it a day and go for a ride - you've worked long enough.

The beauty of the system is it's accuracy. It is by far the most accurate set up I've ever used. It's also so cheap it's nearly free. The downside is that it's slow to set up.

I built a good 100 bikes or so on this deal and it kicked ass. I eventually got an Anvil to save time but this stays around just in case. I encourage you to take the idea and run with it.

Let me know how it goes.

dave

Dave,

Thanks for the pics and instructions. It may be a while before I am running with it but it could make getting started on the right foot a little easier.

Jayme

[cuda2k]

Dave,

Thanks for the pics and instructions. It may be a while before I am running with it but it could make getting started on the right foot a little easier.

Jayme

I'll second what Jayme said. Somewhere back in my mind there's a growing ember of an idea to have a go at building a frame for myself one day (after I ride the dickens out of Kirk for a while that is). And on the topic of paint work, the more fantastic paint schemes you post the more of my $$ I see going to Joe Bell when my number comes up.

[Dave Kirk]

I'm glad the photos and instructions help - or at least inspire. I think it's important to remember that there are many ways to get a job done and the one accepted way should not be confused with the only way. I also think that a framebuilder is a fabricator and problem solver..........or at least should be............. and that if they challenge the accepted ways of doing things and take differing paths that good things can come of it. Most folks can color within the lines - let the color stray outside the lines and enjoy the results.

Thanks again for asking.

dave

[Jayme]

I'm glad the photos and instructions help - or at least inspire. I think it's important to remember that there are many ways to get a job done and the one accepted way should not be confused with the only way. I also think that a framebuilder is a fabricator and problem solver..........or at least should be............. and that if they challenge the accepted ways of doing things and take differing paths that good things can come of it. Most folks can color within the lines - let the color stray outside the lines and enjoy the results.

Thanks again for asking.

dave

"Inspire" is the perfect word for it. "Help" is what I will be asking for when I try to build something similar. I just have to say this; Dave, you rock! Your presence and participation here is sooooo appreciated.

Jayme

[Dave Kirk]

"Inspire" is the perfect word for it. "Help" is what I will be asking for when I try to build something similar. I just have to say this; Dave, you rock! Your presence and participation here is sooooo appreciated.

Jayme

Thanks so much - it's good to know the time and effort is appreciated.

You know I just noticed that this thread now has over 20,000 views. Honestly this makes my day. I'm honored. Thank you all for reading and asking questions. Keep them coming.


dave

[akelman]

You know I just noticed that this thread now has over 20,000 views. Honestly this makes my day.

I regret to say that 19,700 of those views are from me. Still, 300 others ain't nothing.

[progetto]

Dave,
I cringe every time I see your framebuilding gear near that beautiful Lotus,reminds me of the time I knocked a metal bar from my mezzanine floor onto the bonnet of my car and another time a cement fiber sheet fell over onto the side panel of another. I hate using my garage as a workshop as well as housing the vehicles,I've got a 40' container waiting to be fitted out so I can access my gear easier.
Bill

[Dave Kirk]

I regret to say that 19,700 of those views are from me. Still, 300 others ain't nothing.

You might need to get out more. :)

Thanks for your interest.


dave

[Dave Kirk]

Dave,
I cringe every time I see your framebuilding gear near that beautiful Lotus,reminds me of the time I knocked a metal bar from my mezzanine floor onto the bonnet of my car and another time a cement fiber sheet fell over onto the side panel of another. I hate using my garage as a workshop as well as housing the vehicles,I've got a 40' container waiting to be fitted out so I can access my gear easier.
Bill

I hear you. I've very careful around the car and I don't ever have big heavy things that I'm swinging around in the shop. On the rare occasion that I do i move the car just so I don't need to worry about it. One of these days I might have more room to work but I'm not sweating it now. My space works very well.

The real issue with the car being there is more one of distraction - there is always car work to be done and it could be too easy to put the frame done and start working on the car. Oh, life is so full of temptations.

Thanks for your concern!

dave

[timto]

DK, noticed none of the newer JK Race bikes are showing up with carbon forks anymore. Seem to recall few earlier appearances of the carbon fork. Was this a conscious decision to phase out carbon fork offerings or simply your clients not asking for them? Care to share your thoughts?

[Dave Kirk]

DK, noticed none of the newer JK Race bikes are showing up with carbon forks anymore. Seem to recall few earlier appearances of the carbon fork. Was this a conscious decision to phase out carbon fork offerings or simply your clients not asking for them? Care to share your thoughts?

Good Morning,

When I first introduced the JKS it was available with a carbon fork. While I personally liked the ride with the carbon fork I didn't love it. Seeing as the bike appealed to weight conscious clients I thought I'd offer the frame with a carbon fork and I sold a good number in this configuration. In the mean time I was testing the ride, performance and feel of the carbon fork relative to the lightweight JKS steel fork I also offered and I kept coming back to the same conclusion - the steel fork was better on all counts. There were only two places the carbon forks had an advantage IMO - the carbon fork is a bit lighter and I had zero hours of labor invested into them.

Fast forward a bit and I had a few clients with the JKS and carbon fork combo ask about getting a steel fork to try in place of the carbon fork. I think I built 4-5 of them and each person said the same thing - the steel fork was a better choice for them.

At this point I decided it was best to stop offering the carbon option. If I know the bike is better and the client will be happier with the steel fork I feel it's my responsibility to make sure they can get the best I can offer. I did have a few potential clients walk away because they really wanted the carbon fork but most folks were open minded and trusted my guidance and to a person they have all loved the end result. At this point every Kirk frame has a made to match Kirk steel fork. The forks are just as 'made to measure' as the frames are and the rake is chosen to match the frame and the weight of the blades/steerer is matched to the rider and the end use. There are no stock forks, just as there are no stock frames.

Thanks for the question.

Dave

[timto]

Good Morning,

When I first introduced the JKS it was available with a carbon fork. While I personally liked the ride with the carbon fork I didn't love it. Seeing as the bike appealed to weight conscious clients I thought I'd offer the frame with a carbon fork and I sold a good number in this configuration. In the mean time I was testing the ride, performance and feel of the carbon fork relative to the lightweight JKS steel fork I also offered and I kept coming back to the same conclusion - the steel fork was better on all counts. There were only two places the carbon forks had an advantage IMO - the carbon fork is a bit lighter and I had zero hours of labor invested into them.

Fast forward a bit and I had a few clients with the JKS and carbon fork combo ask about getting a steel fork to try in place of the carbon fork. I think I built 4-5 of them and each person said the same thing - the carbon fork was a better choice for them.

At this point I decided it was best to stop offering the carbon option. If I know the bike is better and the client will be happier with the steel fork I feel it's my responsibility to make sure they can get the best I can offer. I did have a few potential clients walk away because they really wanted the carbon fork but most folks were open minded and trusted my guidance and to a person they have all loved the end result. At this point every Kirk frame has a made to match Kirk steel fork. The forks are just as 'made to measure' as the frames are and the rake is chosen to match the frame and the weight of the blades/steerer is matched to the rider and the end use. There are no stock forks, just as there are no stock frames.

Thanks for the question.

Dave

Awesome - thanks and good to know.

[Bob Ross]

Fast forward a bit and I had a few clients with the JKS and carbon fork combo ask about getting a steel fork to try in place of the carbon fork. I think I built 4-5 of them and each person said the same thing - the carbon fork was a better choice for them.

Wait, what? Did you mean to write "the steel fork was a better choice for them?"

[Dave Kirk]

Wait, what? Did you mean to write "the steel fork was a better choice for them?"

Good catch - I need a full time editor.

I'll change it.

Thanks,

dave

[Joel Benjamin L]

hi dave,

have any of the jks x frames been built other than your original test model?
do you have any feedback from customers thus far?

thank you,
joel