Crazy question: Anyone work in international shipping?

[Saab2000]

I am attempting to ship two car seatbelts to the former Mrs. Saab2000. They are in the box from the manufacturer. She works in the car business (5th generation Opel dealership) but their connections with GM have largely dried up with the acquisition of Opel by Peugeot. Her business is in Switzerland.

So she asked me if I would help get her some seatbelts for a US car under her care (Corvette as it happens) that had a minor accident, releasing the belt pre-tensioners. These belts are labeled as Class 9 Hazardous Material due to a tiny charge in them to instantly tighten the belt. They are like airbags in that they are a one-time usage item.

Anyway, so I have these two boxes with perfectly nice seatbelts that nobody will take. Not even companies like UPS which will take Class 9 Hazmat. But I'm not an authorized shipper so they won't accept them from me. USPS and FedEx both told me no as well.

I'm not angry or upset at them. I get that they need to be in compliance and that these regulations exist for a reason.

Does anyone here have any expertise in this? Price is not really an object, within reason. The source I got them from won't ship internationally, which is why I got tasked with this. We both assumed it would be a simple matter of me bringing it to any legit shipping company, filling out the papers and a week later she'd have them, legally and safely.

Any tips would be extremely welcome. It appears the only people who can ship hazmat via these entities are authorized hazmat handlers.

[Chik]

I assume they cannot be brought on board a commercial passenger flight either in the cabin or in the hold?

[Saab2000]

I assume they cannot be brought on board a commercial passenger flight either in the cabin or in the hold?

Not without proper declaration and paperwork. As trivial as this seems, I will not do this improperly. My job is full of regulations and mostly they’re there for a good reason.

Here I’m a customer and I’m just trying to do this the right way but I keep running into some challenges.

[sk_tle]

I'd say the best way for you would be to sell back those seat belts locally and ask your ex-wife to pull her fingers out of her ass and find them either either in Switzerland (there are corvettes everywhere, shouldn't be that hard no ?) or ask a US business to send the belt themselves through their usual transporters account. As an individual I can understand no transporter would follow you on that one.

[sk_tle]

Sorry I couldn't resist :-)

Walter Sobchak: I'm saying, I see what you're getting at, Dude, he kept the money. My point is, here we are, it's shabbos, the sabbath, which I'm allowed to break only if it's a matter of life or death...
The Dude: Will you come off it, Walter? You're not even fucking Jewish, man.
Walter Sobchak: What the fuck are you talkin' about?
The Dude: Man, you're fucking Polish Catholic...
Walter Sobchak: What the fuck are you talking about? I converted when I married Cynthia! Come on, Dude!
The Dude: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah...
Walter Sobchak: And you know this!
The Dude: Yeah, and five fucking years ago you were divorced.
Walter Sobchak: So what are you saying? When you get divorced you turn in your library card? You get a new license? You stop being Jewish? I'm as Jewish as fucking Tevye.
The Dude: It's all a part of your sick Cynthia thing, man. Taking care of her fucking dog. Going to her fucking synagogue. You're living in the fucking past.
Walter Sobchak: Three thousand years of beautiful tradition, from Moses to Sandy Koufax...You're goddamn right I'm living in the fucking past! I'm... Jesus. What the hell happened?

[Chik]

Not without proper declaration and paperwork. As trivial as this seems, I will not do this improperly. My job is full of regulations and mostly they’re there for a good reason.

Here I’m a customer and I’m just trying to do this the right way but I keep running into some challenges.

I wasn't suggesting that you have them smuggled.

I had a brush with these regulations in a previous life when a colleague from an overseas subsidiary sent a product requiring after-sales servicing without properly declaring it with the requisite forms AND the product not having been prepped properly for shipment. It was done out of ignorance as well as carelessness. We got caught because it was in plain sight, given that the commercial invoice clearly stated what it was but the additional paperwork was simply not there. We were assessed a mid-5 figure fine, and then we successfully appealed to have the fine reduced (to a low 5 figure amount) AND persuade them to release the consignment instead of destroying it. We were just thankful that we didn't blow up the plane...

Anyway, from your OP, it sounds like one of the requirements is that you need to be an authorised shipper. I was thinking of using one of those freelance couriers to take on a flight with proper documents, but it sounds like you may not qualify to obtain the docs?

[Saab2000]

I'd say the best way for you would be to sell back those seat belts locally and ask your ex-wife to pull her fingers out of her ass and find them either either in Switzerland (there are corvettes everywhere, shouldn't be that hard no ?) or ask a US business to send the belt themselves through their usual transporters account. As an individual I can understand no transporter would follow you on that one.

She's a dealer and can't seem to find them, so it's not a matter of her pulling her fingers out of her ass. And the reason she asked me to do this was that the place she sourced them won't ship internationally. It's possible she can find them but the cost is probably absurd. The change of Opel ownership from GM to Peugeot is also likely a factor.

We'll get this figured out.

Chik's story about being fined is eye opening.

I don't think the items are actually dangerous but they are classified and labeled as hazmat so trying to skirt the rules is a bad idea on several levels.

[kytyree]

I had to ship something similar once when I was still with the military. It was possible to ship via the normal methods if properly packed/marked etc but the cost was quite high. We ended up having one of our folks hand carry it as buying an airline ticket was cheaper, still had to be properly packed/marked but we were able to do that post 9/11 though it was not international, just coast to coast here in the US. Pretty amazing really as the item was roughly the size of a shotgun shell and nowhere near as hazardous, an aircraft part no less.

If the cost with say Fedex/UPS/DHL is within reason the hard part may be finding someone trained to pack and mark it properly.

But you've probably been around aviation enough to know that hazardous cargo is ever evolving, or at least it seems that way to me.

[skunkty14]

I have background in hazmat/dangerous good shipping to coordinate sample product deliveries to various partners and investors for my current and previous employer.

Two substantial hurdles here: first, whoever is offering the shipment (shipper) must be trained/certified in domestic regulation (49CFR in the US) and trained in ICAO/IATA Dangerous Goods Regulations (DGR)*. Second, the shipper must be internally approved by the carrier (UPS, FedEx, DHL, etc.) to offer dangerous goods (commonly referred to as hazmat). Basically they want to verify the entity is real, has liability insurance, etc. Both of these points are true whether the shipment is destined for an international or domestic consignee.
Very few consultants in the space of coordinating these types of shipments for clients without either of the points above already addressed (only one I aware of is based in Toronto). IMHO the best bet is to find a vendor who will ship directly to your destination. Recipient does not need to be a commercial entity in most cases so if the Peugeot name is a hurdle for a GM supplier you could simply send package to another address.
You're 100% certain the product would require a fully regulated shipment? No limited quantity or consumer goods exemption cited in the documentation?
*not enforceable regulation, consensus standard drafted by industry

[Bewheels]

I'd say the best way for you would be to sell back those seat belts locally and ask your ex-wife to pull her fingers out of her ass and find them either either in Switzerland (there are corvettes everywhere, shouldn't be that hard no ?) or ask a US business to send the belt themselves through their usual transporters account. As an individual I can understand no transporter would follow you on that one.

Saab is smart guy and is simply asking for help from a group of people that have a wide range of experiences. I don't think derogatory comments about his ex-wife fall into the category of helping solve the problem that has been presented.

[Saab2000]

You're 100% certain the product would require a fully regulated shipment? No limited quantity or consumer goods exemption cited in the documentation?
*not enforceable regulation, consensus standard drafted by industry

I'm not sure. But this is not a normal consumer product so I'm not sure about personal exemptions? I'll try to look through the papers it came with. But it was boxed with a Class 9 label, which immediately caught my eye.

I too have some background in dangerous goods as well, but mostly in identification, not really in regulations beyond that. My employer won't carry dangerous goods but as with any rule, there are exceptions in small quantities for some classes of DGs.

This is a Class 9 "miscellaneous" item as it doesn't really fall under any other category. I've been running into some challenges as I'm not a licensed shipper. But I'm not totally out of ideas yet.

[skunkty14]

I'll try to look through the papers it came with. But it was boxed with a Class 9 label, which immediately caught my eye.

Odds are high it's a fully regulated product in that case; even if it isn't and the manufacturer is managing to a higher standard you would have a tough time justifying reclassification if asked since you're not in the same industry.
If you post a photo of the marking/labeling on the package I can dig in a little further to see if there's any loophole that may make this easier for you.

[Saab2000]

Odds are high it's a fully regulated product in that case; even if it isn't and the manufacturer is managing to a higher standard you would have a tough time justifying reclassification if asked since you're not in the same industry.
If you post a photo of the marking/labeling on the package I can dig in a little further to see if there's any loophole that may make this easier for you.

Here ya go. I have two seatbelts and they came packed looking like this.

[skunkty14]

Here ya go. I have two seatbelts and they came packed looking like this.

Solid info, nice work. Unfortunately no ltd qty exemption cited in IATA (see below). No major state or carrier exemptions which is good. Corner case but if you're speaking with people with a background in this USG 16 does not apply based on my research.
Otherwise nothing that unique with this particular product from a DG perspective. Doesn't change the two hurdles I initially described but since USG 16 doesn't apply you don't have any additional DG related hurdles to clear in order to export this product.

IMG_4124.jpg

[Saab2000]

Solid info, nice work. Unfortunately no ltd qty exemption cited in IATA (see below). No major state or carrier exemptions which is good. Corner case but if you're speaking with people with a background in this USG 16 does not apply based on my research.
Otherwise nothing that unique with this particular product from a DG perspective. Doesn't change the two hurdles I initially described but since USG 16 doesn't apply you don't have any additional DG related hurdles to clear in order to export this product.

IMG_4124.jpg

Talked to FedEx and they pointed me in the direction of a company that is authorized to package and label this stuff. Waiting for a call back.

Thanks for looking into this for me!

I think this is a solid case of spending a dollar to save a penny! I am going to give it a whirl but otherwise I am going to have my ex try to source these through "normal" channels and that might just end up costing "normal" amounts of money.

I'm really trying to help her out here because she has really done me solid so many times in the 27 years we've known each other. I'm in her debt in so many ways so when she asks for a favor I really try to get it done.

[j44ke]

The pre-9-11 pre-EU answer to this was to send it by boat. But that required finding a shipping broker who sold space in containers. Then you had to coordinate shipment from the port of entry, customs, etc. So not user friendly in other words. Everything on manual. I remember this process from a long time ago though when my father was head of the chemistry department at his university and infrequently had to deal with procurement and his headaches became part of dinner conversation. I am sure most of this has changed, but maybe see if you can find a shipping facilitator/broker rather than a name-brand shipping company and then leave retrieval from the port of entry to your ex-wife.

edit: I see above that perhaps FedEx has sent you in this direction. Good luck!

[Saab2000]

The issue is more one of regulatory compliance rather than any real danger. Since they are classified as a DG it becomes more complicated.

Thanks to all who have answered.

[endo shi]

I have nothing to add other than I find this thread fascinating. Who knew seatbelts were so complicated, and that getting one even if you're a car dealer with connections is nearly impossible, and that no one can help ship such a seemingly simple item. And meanwhile there's some rich Swiss dude just waiting by his phone for a call that his Corvette is ready to pickup.

Keep us in the loop with what happens!

[SteveP]

A couple of years ago a buddy of mine who lives in Europe asked me to bring a battery for his laptop over to him when i was headed that way.
He shipped it to me..
It came with a huge orange sticker saying it could not be shipped on a plane...
It went back. It would have unquestionably cause me trouble at the airport.

[Chik]

A couple of years ago a buddy of mine who lives in Europe asked me to bring a battery for his laptop over to him when i was headed that way.
He shipped it to me..
It came with a huge orange sticker saying it could not be shipped on a plane...
It went back. It would have unquestionably cause me trouble at the airport.

Shipping batteries on their own is not allowed. If it is inserted in the machine that it's supposed to power, such as a laptop, then you can send the laptop with the battery as a normal parcel. I have no idea why that is.

In terms of flying with it, it's a lot easier, cf., https://www.faa.gov/about/office_org..._batteries.pdf