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New Kitchens / Remodels
By g-d this is VSalon and we can't have anything less than excessive overdoing it yah? Kidding.
This might be a thread to show your amazing kitchen or before / after OR to talk about a project so here we go.
After 22 yrs. living with a barely functional kitchen from which I've served the masses and endured...oh why bother? My kitchen is just awful.
We are beginning to trot contractors thru the house and talk about "what it". All I know so far is that I'll finally get a gas oven, adequate counter space to work/prep. the rest is up in the air. I'll post some diagrams of the space in time as well as some ideas.
Would love to hear about stoves, built in appliances etc. that rock your world. I'm keen to have some sort of a fast top broiler or even a small salamander installed since i do alot of top browning last min. Big / Deep kitchen sinks YES!!! Talk to me about amazing kitchen sinks.
Here we go...
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Re: New Kitchens / Remodels
Oh man, that's a big project. We redid the kitchen in our last house, superficial only, and it was a pain. But the end product was great and so much nicer than the hideous finishes that came before. Helped us sell the house quickly, too.
In this house we ended up with a crazy oven/stove. We're not all that into cooking, but I swear everything we make is better and easier. We had natural gas at the last house and a propane tank here. It's pricier, but still worth it. Here's the first stove that's ever rocked my world.
Attachment 84367
Ours has a matching hood. I'm not looking forward to replacing it should it ever break beyond repair.
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Re: New Kitchens / Remodels
The Kitchen Work Triangle is where it all begins and if you are having a designer to help layout your kitchen, they will be familiar with the process. Good exhaust and good lighting, not necessarily in that order, are two other key pieces of information and plenty of prep space to dice, slice, chop, rinse and roll, especially since you are a cookaholic.
I am also a fan of stainless steel appliance surfaces and stainless sinks...deep double sinks and faucets which allow large pots and pans to be filled in the sink. A quiet and efficient dishwasher, double oven (one convection) and a 5-6 burner gas cooktop are always busy at our house. Refrigerators...all a matter of preference. Some like the side by side and others like the over or under freezer. We didn't select an in-door water/ice dispenser but some folks love them.
Don't forget power outlets for blenders, food processors, coffee grinders/makers, iPads, etc. Wire your kitchen for sound and speakers too as we entertain a lot at the island. Material selections for tops and backsplashes can be overwhelming. We used granite for the tops and tumbled limestone for the backsplash, but with the many surface material choices available today, I might have passed on the granite at what, $50/SF? Porcelain tile completed our floor but I might have chosen wood looking back on it. Easier on the feet but I was worried that it would clash with the maple cabinets.
Cabinets are tough to beat from a manufacturer like Kraft Maid, etc. Beyond a specialty kitchen shop, places like The Home Depot carry some decent brands and the soft touch drawers are a must anymore. Wood finishes or laminate...what does the Queen like and what will the next buyer like? Things to think about.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kitchen_work_triangle
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Re: New Kitchens / Remodels
Queen likes off white or grey stained wood cabinets and a mix of glass doors with solid. Dark Granite...not so much, we are leaning twords something manmade.
GREAT idea to have power outlets for charging etc.
We just got back from a tour of a neighbors house that one of the contractors we are reviewing did and it is fabulous.
Matt, do you use that grill? Our situation calls for a 6 burner stove/oven combo. I had hoped to use a lightly used Wolf cooktop/grill that a pal gave me...we shall see if it passes muster. Maybe throwing good money at old tech. The cooptop is 15 years old but when it was removed it was brand new.
LIGHTING YES! lots of it, I'm a freak for good light.
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Re: New Kitchens / Remodels
TT...I'm a fan of Sarah Susanka and you might find inspiration in some of her ideas relating to your kitchen and its relationship to the balance of your living space.
Sarah Susanka
http://youtu.be/IKhQIn6m08Q
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Re: New Kitchens / Remodels
You're a 90 minute drive from having some Amish or Mennonite guys build you an amazing set of custom cabinets...
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Re: New Kitchens / Remodels
Are you thinking of pastry or hand-kneaded bread? A nice marble slab (maybe even a chilled one if you're into ice cream) is really nice for French kneading.
BTW, the more 220V appliances you can get, the more efficient and lightweight your kitchen will be. I'm thinking blenders, espresso machines and grinders, fridges, induction/electric water boilers, etc. For example, Cadco 220V convection ovens go from cold to finished scones in 13 minutes flat, and are cool again 5 minutes after that. It's a godsend for summertime baking, and they make the best brioche and cheesecake and biscotti I have ever had. They even provide computer-controlled steam. Awesome.
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Re: New Kitchens / Remodels
If you're really into cooking....Soapstone countertops. No fancy sealers, you don't ever have to worry about temperatures, scratches buff out, etc... I regularly set 500 degree iron on my countertop:
https://scontent-lga1-1.xx.fbcdn.net...6c&oe=564981EE
https://scontent-lga1-1.xx.fbcdn.net...3c&oe=563722C7
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Re: New Kitchens / Remodels
We don't really use the burner, Josh. We don't do much grilling and when we do we have a big grill outside.
I second UnfilteredDregs recommendation on soapstone. We'll eventually replace the counters in our kitchen and that's the way we'll go.
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Re: New Kitchens / Remodels
Re the 220 appliances. Wow, that is a revelation for me, no idea they existed.
Thanks for the reassurance with soapstone, i had assumed it was not durable enough for counters. My experience with it is in old french kitchens where it looks its age.
Fwiiw i have a large rock maple dinner table top i have been saving for the new kitchen. It will make a terrific prep surface.
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2 Attachment(s)
Re: New Kitchens / Remodels
We bought our houses year ago, and just got around to renovating the kitchen, floors, and fake wood paneling throughout the house.
Attachment 84375
This is mid removal of cabinets and prep for demo.
Attachment 84376
Now I need to learn how to make cabinets.
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Re: New Kitchens / Remodels
I can tell you that I hate, hate, hate my kitchen. It's basically a dark corridor with barely enough space for one person to work, let alone two. Entertaining is a mess and no matter how hard I try, inevitably people will cram in there. If I were redesigning, One of the things I would do (beside blowout a wall) is place my island outside of the work triangle. That way, people can hang out and I have space to do odds and ends.
I really like the less obvious idea of wiring for sound, even if its just a couple inconspicuous speakers for background noise when we're partying. A well placed skylight or three could add some natural light without taking away wall space but they could take away space for light fixtures.
nahtnoj provides a good thought... those amish and mennonite dudes can work some wood. If you find the right ones; they'll be cheaper than a comparable mainstream brand.
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Re: New Kitchens / Remodels
Quote:
Originally Posted by
BShow
If I were redesigning, One of the things I would do (beside blowout a wall) is place my island outside of the work triangle. That way, people can hang out and I have space to do odds and ends.
Our island is far outside the triangle. For everyday usage it feels out of place and just collects clutter rather than being useful for food prep or cooking. But, when we have people over it is perfect. A great place to set up food and drinks and people always gather around it and aren't in the way of using the kitchen at all. So, if entertaining is your priority, I wholeheartedly agree.
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Re: New Kitchens / Remodels
We gutted our 1960's kitchen and expanded it into our 2 car garage to have an open kitchen and family room space.
1. If you are changing your layout considerably, you should engage a real architect/designer, not just a GC who has done a lot of kitchens. We drove the design and came up with the ideas of where to put a pantry, how far to push into the garage space, etc, but an architect/designer would have known that the cabinet doors were going to bang into each other in certain spots and that we should have gone 1-2 feet further into the family room for more countertop space.
2. Go with a wide sink, but not a deep one. You're already too tall, and bending down into an eleven inch deep sink will make you nuts. We went with 8 inches deep and it is much better than my parent's who went 11. And I'm only 6'1"
3. Get a cabinet panel on the dishwasher. We grabbed the Bosch 800 series and I LOVE THAT THING. It has a third rack for your awkward serving and cooking utensils that we even put our chef knives on. Such a good feature for that appliance. Don't be turned off by the longer than average run time. It hasn't been a problem.
4. We did honed jet mist for the outer and marble for the island. Pretty happy with both, though the marble still makes me nervous since citrus-y items will leave permanent etching
5. If you are tearing it to the studs, put in speakers, wire for the future as much as possible, even if you don't plan on it now.
6. Consult with some geeks about the best electronic stuff for your kitchen. Don't expect the electrician or GC to know that stuff
7. Since the garage didn't have heat, we opted for a wall mounted ductless mini split. This allowed us to ditch the old radiator in the kitchen too. It's been great for heating and cooling but I wish our HVAC guy knew more about the geek features. Ours is not wifi compatible, but you can get some that are which is nice for configuring when you are on the way home.
8. We also have a half bath that shares a wall with the kitchen. Since they were tearing off the plaster and exposing the plumbing, I had them rough in a wet bar area. We will eventually add a small sink and bar area
9. Don't be fooled into a counter depth fridge. They are so much smaller and not worth it.
10. Dark floors definitely show a lot more dust. The floors in the rest of our house are lighter and I wish we did lighter in the kitchen too. I was afraid of trying to match and having it look like we tried and failed.
Here's the main kitchen space. It used to end where the header is to the right of the fridge. The picture is taken from the old garage which is now a family/tv area
https://farm4.staticflickr.com/3931/...2a1e85a8_b.jpg
this is the pantry with shelves that my father and I built behind the stove wall. We were originally going to put some swinging doors to hide it, but we've come to appreciate the convenience and we organize it well enough that it's not an eye sore as you walk through to the dining room:
https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7463/...4626f2af_b.jpg
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Quote:
Originally Posted by
Matthew Strongin
Nicely done, rosey!
Thanks. I'll also add, if you plan on having seating at the island, you should do a 12+ inch overhang. We ended up with 14 inches and it is much more comfortable than other island/bar seating which is normally in the 10-12 inch range.
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Re: New Kitchens / Remodels
our kitchen triangle is very obtuse.
I strongly dislike our kitchen. It's going to be the first thing we tackle in the house. Lighting is bad, fixtures are bad, sink is shallow, fridge is placed right next to the door, so neither can be opened beyond 90*. Problem is all the appliances are fairly new, so we have no reason to trash them yet. But damn am I ready to. And they're white. The dining area is right next to the kitchen, which is right next to the living room. It's all one big space, which I prefer. As it is, I'd like to make the kitchen area are little bigger, and reduce the size of the dining area. We have a formal dining room, but it's the bike room. Which gets more use than a formal dining room ever would.
Anyway, hot topic is counter material.
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Re: New Kitchens / Remodels
Looking at a possible kitchen reno next year so went shopping to establish some sort of budget.
So, we checked out appliances at a store yesterday…...within walking distance of TT house. Bluestar looks like it's the current best in class gas range……this from a longtime Wolf owner. I got hooked on this massive built in fridge……..who knew a 48" Liebherr was a bargain in comparison.
Still like natures best granite and soapstone is really nice too. Have a client with soapstone counter top that has the "leather" finish.
Don't dismiss Ikea for cabinets….if they have a style you like.
Have fun.
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Re: New Kitchens / Remodels
Quote:
Originally Posted by
sine
Don't dismiss Ikea for cabinets….if they have a style you like.
a friend of mine did recently get a kitchen's worth of cabinets from Ikea. it did turn out pretty nice looking but I have no idea about quality, durability or price. If quality and durability are like the few ikea shelves that I've bough, I'll pass.
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Re: New Kitchens / Remodels
Quote:
Originally Posted by
BShow
a friend of mine did recently get a kitchen's worth of cabinets from Ikea. it did turn out pretty nice looking but I have no idea about quality, durability or price. If quality and durability are like the few ikea shelves that I've bough, I'll pass.
And the Ikea kitchens aren't even that cheap compared to many of the KraftMaid options. Unless your kitchen looks exactly like the display at the Ikea warehouse, it's not worth it.
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Re: New Kitchens / Remodels
Amish and Mennonite cabinets. No clue where to start. Sooooo I'm guessing first I come up with the spec. than shop it around to these gents? I rather like the idea.
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Re: New Kitchens / Remodels
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Too Tall
Amish and Mennonite cabinets. No clue where to start. Sooooo I'm guessing first I come up with the spec. than shop it around to these gents? I rather like the idea.
Yeah, me neither. I'll ask around and see if I can dig anything up. A few guys I ride with live out towards Amish country. These guys actively avoid new fangled tech such as the internet, so you probably wont find the good ones when you search google. My favorite bike shop is Mennonite owned and their only web presence is a very short feature by bicycling mag for which they interviewed a non-Mennonite employee.
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Re: New Kitchens / Remodels
All the NFS you need for life...I'll send you a couple bottles ;)
Quote:
Originally Posted by
BShow
Yeah, me neither. I'll ask around and see if I can dig anything up. A few guys I ride with live out towards Amish country. These guys actively avoid new fangled tech such as the internet, so you probably wont find the good ones when you search google. My favorite bike shop is Mennonite owned and their only web presence is a very short feature by bicycling mag for which they interviewed a non-Mennonite employee.
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Re: New Kitchens / Remodels
When we moved to California we bought a house with a kitchen that was remodeled in 1983. It was so bad that you could not put a pot on the stove because the top of it would hit the microwave above. Originally we were going to redo the entire thing but then decided not to. The cabinets and drawers were out dated but their guts were of high quality. So instead for replacing everything we decided to reface them. I highly recommend doing this if you like your layout it is soooo much cheaper.
The other thing we did was when we replaced the countertops was we used a company that lazer measured our countertops instead of removing the old ones and taking a template. What this meant was our countertops were they demo and the news ones were installed in a day opposed to demoing the countertops, taking a measurement and waiting 2-3weeks (having your kitchen out of commission) for them to install the new ones.
Finally, we bought kitchen aid applicances except for the frig. They are excellent especially the hood. Our contractor made it his standard hood to recommend after he saw how it performed. Since our kitchen is small we bought a 30inch Bosch built-in refrig. It was a lot money more than a standard refrig but it serves us very well and I am very pleased with it.
https://farm1.staticflickr.com/441/1...3b1a1f24_z.jpg
https://farm1.staticflickr.com/561/2...569751fc_z.jpg
https://farm4.staticflickr.com/3796/...30c87073_b.jpg
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Re: New Kitchens / Remodels
Another note on soapstone. You need to oil it frequently during the first year...like twice a week. It tapers across 2-3 years. I haven't oiled my countertops in at least a year and a half...
My kitchen is funny, the "Work Triangle," everyone talks about is 10' x 10'.
I live in NYC. My entire kitchen is 10' x 10'. It's extremely cozy...nevertheless I can seat 4, like a subway during rush hour, while two people can work. I have 54 sqft of countertop. Plenty of room for me & the Missus as well as our spoilt single-child progeny.
I hustle people into the living room when we have company:
https://scontent-lga1-1.xx.fbcdn.net...29527379_o.jpg
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Re: New Kitchens / Remodels
Quote:
Originally Posted by
UnfilteredDregs
Another note on soapstone. You need to oil it frequently during the first year...like twice a week. It tapers across 2-3 years. I haven't oiled my countertops in at least a year and a half...
My kitchen is funny, the "Work Triangle," everyone talks about is 10' x 10'.
I live in NYC. My entire kitchen is 10' x 10'. It's extremely cozy...nevertheless I can seat 4, like a subway during rush hour, while two people can work. I have 54 sqft of countertop. Plenty of room for me & the Missus as well as our spoilt single-child progeny.
I hustle people into the living room when we have company:
https://scontent-lga1-1.xx.fbcdn.net...29527379_o.jpg
Dude, you need one of those universal remotes. Other than that I have to say that's a pretty sweet setup.
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Re: New Kitchens / Remodels
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Matthew Strongin
Dude, you need one of those universal remotes. Other than that I have to say that's a pretty sweet setup.
(...I've been too lazy to program it...:nuts: )
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Re: New Kitchens / Remodels
Two things that really work in our remodel-
Two sinks- one for dishes/washing, a second smaller one for food prep. If you do a lot of fresh vegetables there is something kind of gross where you're mixing food with dirty pots and dishes. We're not neat freaks and we cook messy, the second sink area stays clean- and the faucet can be pulled out as a hose (maybe not for households with young kids!) Even in our small kitchen, the second sink is important, and the second prep area also helps with the traffic flow, we can easily have two busy cooks in there at the same time when the sink area doesn't get crowded. So rather than one bigger sink, I'd vote for two smaller. ATMO.
Second, we LOVE our Blue Star gas stove. We can only fit a small 30" 4-burner in the space, but one of those burners is capable of 25,000 btu- basically the max allowable by fire code for residential kitchens. I do a lot of wok cooking and searing and a normal stove doesn't cut it if especially if you are cooking larger quantities for a few people. Tepid temps=shitty wok cooking. We picked up the stove from the distributor out near Silver Spring somewhere and they delivered it to NoVa, best kitchen decision we made (besides the second prep sink)
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This is really helping me.
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Re: New Kitchens / Remodels
Mrs. RW chimed in for a second...try to have your sink centered on a window if possible and exhaust your hood to the outside. We are lucky that we purchased a hood that still has replacement filters avaibale 16 years later. Stockpile a few filters for posterity.
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Re: New Kitchens / Remodels
Quote:
Originally Posted by
rwsaunders
Mrs. RW chimed in for a second...try to have your sink centered on a window if possible and exhaust your hood to the outside. We are lucky that we purchased a hood that still has replacement filters avaibale 16 years later. Stockpile a few filters for posterity.
Yes- definitely vent outside, and don't skimp on the vent power, weak hoods are for people who don't really cook. Some of the additional cost of more expensive hoods is to make them less noisy, so if you don't care much about the B52 motor over the stove you can save a bit of $- go for power and still effectively get the heat and smoke out of the kitchen- loud and smoky = good eating. That is, unless you boil or microwave all your food and are afraid of garlic and capsicum.
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BIG HOOD. 1000+ CFM. There is no substitute. Don't mess around here. I'm currently going through pain with my Zephyr. I have a feeling the phase is reversed and the fans are revolving in the wrong direction.
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Re: New Kitchens / Remodels
Quote:
Originally Posted by
UnfilteredDregs
BIG HOOD. 1000+ CFM. There is no substitute. Don't mess around here. I'm currently going through pain with my Zephyr. I have a feeling the phase is reversed and the fans are revolving in the wrong direction.
On our Zephyr, the fan on the right spins counter-clockwise (when looking up from below) the fan on the left spins clockwise. Ours is adequate- but just barely at 850cfm. I'd get a bigger one next time- although I took a chance and got it new with a couple of small dents on Ebay from contractor surplus for about 50 bucks.
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Whoa -- is that an AGA cooker? I've wondered about them for a while, but didn't know if they heat up the house more or less than anything else. Very cool in any case.
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Re: New Kitchens / Remodels
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Too Tall
Amish and Mennonite cabinets. No clue where to start. Sooooo I'm guessing first I come up with the spec. than shop it around to these gents? I rather like the idea.
I'll talk to my parents on Sunday, and snap some shots of their new kitchen. The guy who did theirs was fantastic. And yeah, like Bill said, dude doesn't have an Instagram account...
And some gratuitous shots of their barn. Guy who did that is Clarence Martin. Total badass.
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Re: New Kitchens / Remodels
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ericpmoss
Whoa -- is that an AGA cooker? I've wondered about them for a while, but didn't know if they heat up the house more or less than anything else. Very cool in any case.
It is an aga. We got the total control, which is electric so we can power it down. When it is fully on, it definitely throws off heat. But with the ability to turn it off, it is not much different than a regular oven.
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Re: New Kitchens / Remodels
And for quick searing, instead of a salamander, get a searzall. Searzall — Booker and Dax
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Josh,
Being 6'5" tall I've often thought that higher than "normal" counter tops would be nice. Not sure how that would affect the Queen or resale.
Just a thought.
Mike
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Quote:
Originally Posted by
ZenNMotion
Two sinks- one for dishes/washing, a second smaller one for food prep.
So obvious, yet I never would have thought of that.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by
joosttx
The cabinets and drawers were out dated but their guts were of high quality. So instead for replacing everything we decided to reface them. I highly recommend doing this if you like your layout it is soooo much cheaper.
Honestly this is great advice. The most important parts of casework are the front panels and the hardware (drawer slides/door hinges/pulls). After it's in 95% of people wouldn't know or care if the shelves and back panels are hardwood or faced MDF.