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Thread: Do you need a Dirt Jumper?

  1. #21
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    Default Re: Do you need a Dirt Jumper?

    Quote Originally Posted by jscottyk View Post
    I bet you were at the Frisco bike park, which is awesome. The jump lines there are great. Very progressive from full beginner on the right to full X-Games on the left. The area above the jump lines has three slopestyle lines and dual slalom course. Great skate park there too.
    Yup, that's the place. I was in heaven, kids were all, "can we go now please?" There was an older guy there on a 20 inch, word is he was a high school teacher as well, he gave me hope. I'd never try a 20 inch, last time I rode my kid's it was all I could do to keep it under me.

    Our city just allowed the local cycling folks to cut some single track through an unused park on the edge of town. A nice not too technical 1 mile loop, with so decent climbing. Not much else going on there, and the single track doesn't bother any of it. Would be the perfect place for a pump track...

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    Default Re: Do you need a Dirt Jumper?

    Quote Originally Posted by rec head View Post
    You guys are the worst. Now I want a dirt jumper or BMX. Luckily Craigslist doesn't have anything in my area.
    There is a dirt jump line a short roll from my house, but I'm only interested in watching. If there was a pump track, however, I'd be right out there looking silly, and a pump track bike would follow because this is the way.

  3. #23
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    Default Re: Do you need a Dirt Jumper?

    Quote Originally Posted by 72gmc View Post
    There is a dirt jump line a short roll from my house, but I'm only interested in watching. If there was a pump track, however, I'd be right out there looking silly, and a pump track bike would follow because this is the way.
    This is the way.

  4. #24
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    Default Re: Do you need a Dirt Jumper?

    Municipal paved pumptracks start at $175k with the company I work for. We try not to do dirt municipal pumptracks any more because it’s almost impossible to insure that they will be properly maintained.

    A dirt pumptrack track kinda just shrinks over time unless people love on it with shovels and picks pretty regularly, or a signed plan for maintenance is in place.

    Quote Originally Posted by Chad View Post

    Our city just allowed the local cycling folks to cut some single track through an unused park on the edge of town. A nice not too technical 1 mile loop, with so decent climbing. Not much else going on there, and the single track doesn't bother any of it. Would be the perfect place for a pump track...

  5. #25
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    Default Re: Do you need a Dirt Jumper?

    Quote Originally Posted by suspectdevice View Post
    Municipal paved pumptracks start at $175k with the company I work for. We try not to do dirt municipal pumptracks any more because it’s almost impossible to insure that they will be properly maintained.

    A dirt pumptrack track kinda just shrinks over time unless people love on it with shovels and picks pretty regularly, or a signed plan for maintenance is in place.
    Interesting. Is paved pump track design & install custom every time, or does a firm like yours have pre-designed options for different plot dimensions? I assume there is a minimum footprint for a workable design, and I’ve been surprised by how small some pump tracks can be.

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    Default Re: Do you need a Dirt Jumper?

    Quote Originally Posted by suspectdevice View Post
    JEALOUS! Whatcha wearing for shoes? I'm trying to get better at 180's right now and i've sacked out yet another pair of vans. A nice supple shoe for feel that also has heel impact protection is an eternal quest.
    I re-learned 180's this summer, took me forever. did get to the point where I can do them clipped in on my 29'er though.

    I would like a bit more of play bike sometime, but riding small wheels brings back some bad memories of waking up in a puddle of my own blood.
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    Default Re: Do you need a Dirt Jumper?

    Every pumptrack is custom. The 3d renders we send clients are usually based on some stock shapes that have radiii that will work in the footprint we have to work with, but besides making sure what we are building lines up with the drainage and electrical lines that the client needs(which is based on our preliminary design), it’s a bit free form.

    Paving is obviously the last step, the substrates we use to build the track are rideable after we lay them down and compact them, so flow-checks are always happening. When we do small and paved, I always default to “is it fun on a razor scooter?” and “is there sessionable non-linear flow potential?”

    Some of the bigger pumptracks we do are multiple areas of paved waves connected by straights with rollers, and when they give us room, some paved beginner/intermediate table top jump lines.

    We did a very small paved track for a condo development in Maryland last spring that had a pretty small footprint while still having an “outer loop” and enough interior snake-run stuff and transfers to satisfy the gamut of users.

    Quote Originally Posted by 72gmc View Post
    Interesting. Is paved pump track design & install custom every time, or does a firm like yours have pre-designed options for different plot dimensions? I assume there is a minimum footprint for a workable design, and I’ve been surprised by how small some pump tracks can be.

  8. #28
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    Default Re: Do you need a Dirt Jumper?

    Thanks for the thoughtful answer.

  9. #29
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    Default Re: Do you need a Dirt Jumper?

    This thread is awesome. I really want to build up a 4x/Slalom hardtail. I bought a BMX bike about 10 years ago and had a ton of fun on some dirt piles in the back yard we shaped into some small jumps but at >6'3" I could never get fully comfortable on the 20" wheels (operator error for sure). I definitely got faster on the mountain bike while I had it thought!!
    laughter has no foreign accent.

  10. #30
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    Default Re: Do you need a Dirt Jumper?

    Quote Originally Posted by Jason Musgrave View Post
    This thread is awesome. I really want to build up a 4x/Slalom hardtail. I bought a BMX bike about 10 years ago and had a ton of fun on some dirt piles in the back yard we shaped into some small jumps but at >6'3" I could never get fully comfortable on the 20" wheels (operator error for sure). I definitely got faster on the mountain bike while I had it thought!!
    Jason, if want a BMX check out 22" wheels. The bike I shown above has the same RAD measurement as my 26" wheeled DJ, and is just a bit shorter than my Trek Remedy.

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    Default Re: Do you need a Dirt Jumper?

    Quote Originally Posted by Jason Musgrave View Post
    This thread is awesome. I really want to build up a 4x/Slalom hardtail. I bought a BMX bike about 10 years ago and had a ton of fun on some dirt piles in the back yard we shaped into some small jumps but at >6'3" I could never get fully comfortable on the 20" wheels (operator error for sure). I definitely got faster on the mountain bike while I had it thought!!
    If you have, or no someone with a sloping farm / meadow, I cant imagine having much more fun than building a track and ripping ruts and flat turns for a few hours.

    I spent a decent amount of time in skateparks and dirtjumps as a kid, mostly on a 26", but later on a 20". Only reason I got into the 20"s to be was the fact that we could ride them in my friends basement in the winter months, as well as not feeling like an outcast, amongst groups of other outcasts at the skatepark. I definitely was never any good, it never came natural to me, but I felt even less natural on a 20" (even after spending lots of time on it). But then again as 6'4" lanky kid in highschool pretty much everything was un-natural for me.

    I did eventually end up purchasing an eastern traildigger 24" dad BMX bike, it was kind of cool, but still was short length wise for me. Felt like a crapier version of a park MTB, couldnt possibly imagine trying to ride that thing "fast".

    p4pb3131124.jpg

    All the best bikes I rode were borrowed when I broke things, one friend had a Evil imperial built for park that was pretty darn amazing, below I borrowed another Evil from a teammate for a race when I broke another frame. Coincidentally also probably the only time I rode bikes big enough for me.

    3098_1093566059401_1776123_n.jpg
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  12. #32
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    Default Re: Do you need a Dirt Jumper?

    is that dual track at Catamount in Williston, VT corca 2010? That was some mighty fine racing.
    There is a permanent dual slalom track on the other side of the hill that they’ll probably get back to racing on Thursday nights again.

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    Default Re: Do you need a Dirt Jumper?

    Quote Originally Posted by suspectdevice View Post
    is that dual track at Catamount in Williston, VT corca 2010? That was some mighty fine racing.
    There is a permanent dual slalom track on the other side of the hill that they’ll probably get back to racing on Thursday nights again.
    Yep, those years were the most fun I ever had racing mountain bikes! Those were also my favorite type of courses (and the only ones I was any good at). I raced a few wedsnesday night short track XC races there over the last few years and they sometimes had the finish on the slalom track which is always a blast for me. Also did a few laps on the CX bike this year after the solo CX racing they were holding, ha. I wish I was a bit closer, so much mid week racing in VT, really hoping it can come back this year
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    Default Re: Do you need a Dirt Jumper?

    Salad days, for sure. That track could be in almost any pasture with some cambers as long as someone has a few hours for prep, thats why it was great! I did one siting mission for it and then a motivated UVM student had it ready by the weekend.
    Berms and jumps are neat and everything, but getting to the apex of a flat corner before the other guy is 3000 percent the best part of bike riding for this old bird. It makes me sad that 99 percent of “dirt jump bikes” never get raced, and certainly don’t get raced on loose ground much any more.

    Flat grass corners are life, probably why i find it so hard to quit promoting cyclocross races...


    Quote Originally Posted by s_curran View Post
    Yep, those years were the most fun I ever had racing mountain bikes! Those were also my favorite type of courses (and the only ones I was any good at). I raced a few wedsnesday night short track XC races there over the last few years and they sometimes had the finish on the slalom track which is always a blast for me. Also did a few laps on the CX bike this year after the solo CX racing they were holding, ha. I wish I was a bit closer, so much mid week racing in VT, really hoping it can come back this year

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    Default Re: Do you need a Dirt Jumper?

    Mickey - Geek out on slalom hardtails for a minute will ya - angles / lengths / setup / anything!
    laughter has no foreign accent.

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    Default Re: Do you need a Dirt Jumper?

    Slalom hardtails are dead. It’s all freestyle bikes now. Kinda like how cx bikes are dead and it’s all gravel bikes, but even worse.

    Sub 16” chainstays are good for pretending to be a bmx bike, but definitely don't weight the front wheel enough for “slalom” to be in the name. 16.25” stays seem to be around still if you look at some aggro trail hardtails.
    In my a book a “slalom” hardtail needs to be fun and fast to descend a real mtb trail. The bb needs to be low enough to stick, but not so low that you can’t get good pump. A shorter wheelbase can allow a higher bb bike to still corner well if it’s slack while maintaining stability- you raise and lower your personal ass to modulate slip/grip. That’s also how you get good pump, so the higher bb and shorter wheelbase can actually be pretty quick.
    BB heights approaching 13” aren’t out of the picture, especially if you like 175mm cranks out of the gate.

    130-140mm travel, hta in the 66-67 region, tall barz so you can ride all the way off the back of the bike and still fully weight the front wheel at any yaw angle.

    Marin sells a bike called the San Quentin. One of those in Medium (445mm reach) would be good for taller people, a small would be good for the sub 5’9” set. It’s gonna suck on a pump track or dirt jumps compared to a shorter, steeper bike with less fork and less bb drop, but it will have all the stability one needs to rip some corners.

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