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Thread: Tubeless valves

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    Default Tubeless valves

    I’ve got some Lindarets valves on the way that seem to be stuck in a COVID holding pattern, so I’ll be doing this again soon.

    In the meantime, my tubeless valves have suddenly decided to leak air between the rim and the lock ring. Initially, I thought that just meant the sealant was gone...which was right, but a sealant refresh didn’t fix the problem.

    Tightening the lock ring down, makes the O ring squish out, but then the lock ring has flats on it which would suggest you should be needing tools to do it.

    And the winner is...
    Colin Mclelland

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    Default Re: Tubeless valves

    Is always a good idea to check the valve hole on the rim: use a 1/4" drill bit as gauge.
    Does it fit snug? Good. Does it fit loose? Not good!
    Andrea "Gattonero" Cattolico, head mechanic @Condor Cycles London


    "Caron, non ti crucciare:
    vuolsi così colà dove si puote
    ciò che si vuole, e più non dimandare"

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    Default Re: Tubeless valves

    Quote Originally Posted by Gattonero View Post
    Is always a good idea to check the valve hole on the rim: use a 1/4" drill bit as gauge.
    Does it fit snug? Good. Does it fit loose? Not good!
    Cheers Andrea. The answer is good.
    Colin Mclelland

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    Default Re: Tubeless valves

    Quote Originally Posted by Colinmclelland View Post
    Cheers Andrea. The answer is good.
    Ideally, you want to have the valve tight enough but not having the need for a tool. In fact, you can actually omit the o-ring on the outer side of the rim, it's all about how good is the seal on the inner side of the rim. I really like Mavic and Campagnolo valves for this, have a beefy rubber end that fits well in most rims that are decently done (Alex Rims and Pacenti are not in the list!)
    Andrea "Gattonero" Cattolico, head mechanic @Condor Cycles London


    "Caron, non ti crucciare:
    vuolsi così colà dove si puote
    ciò che si vuole, e più non dimandare"

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    Default Re: Tubeless valves

    Could very well be the tape, too. Most “leaking valves” I’ve seen are actually leaking tape taking the path of least resistance. Spoke holes are pretty tight.
     

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    Default Re: Tubeless valves

    I've used Stan's because they're everywhere. I prefer these if I think ahead. Boyd Cycling Tubeless Valve Pair
    Weight Doper

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    Default Re: Tubeless valves

    Quote Originally Posted by bigbill View Post
    I've used Stan's because they're everywhere. I prefer these if I think ahead. Boyd Cycling Tubeless Valve Pair
    What he said. Excellent quality.

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    Default Re: Tubeless valves

    It's fundamentally a design issue: the design inherited from MTB use is not up to the task of containing air at road bike pressures. I have one pair of wheels with Stan's Grail rims, one works well 90% of the time and the other about 5% of the time and this has been the case since new.

    Before I gave up on them I was playing with changing the interface by bonding in a flat face that would take an O ring clamp system. I based this on the system used in trucks; since truck tyres run at much higher pressures than car tyres they don't use the same system.

    There's a lesson in this.

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    Default Re: Tubeless valves

    I’m still regularly surprised at how complacent MTBers have gotten about the various difficulties of tubeless. Especially in higher-end shop settings, we’ve all been dealing with all of it for so long that we take for granted it’s periodically a mysterious pain in the ass.

    But...we also all take for granted that we wouldn’t go back to tubes for anything.
     

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    Default Re: Tubeless valves

    Quote Originally Posted by Applesauce View Post
    I’m still regularly surprised at how complacent MTBers have gotten about the various difficulties of tubeless. Especially in higher-end shop settings, we’ve all been dealing with all of it for so long that we take for granted it’s periodically a mysterious pain in the ass.

    But...we also all take for granted that we wouldn’t go back to tubes for anything.
    continued propagation of insert technology will force an improvement of tape/valve systems

    retaping a shitty tape job is one thing, retaping a shitty tape job after you got a cushcore in is something else
     

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    Default Re: Tubeless valves

    Quote Originally Posted by Applesauce View Post
    I’m still regularly surprised at how complacent MTBers have gotten about the various difficulties of tubeless. Especially in higher-end shop settings, we’ve all been dealing with all of it for so long that we take for granted it’s periodically a mysterious pain in the ass.

    But...we also all take for granted that we wouldn’t go back to tubes for anything.
    They never had the joy of fitting 20mm clinchers (or unstretched Conti Track tubs on Pista wheels, for that matter) on those very shallow rims that were so common in that day. You remember those with an ERD no less than 615mm for a 700c, yes?
    And because history can be cruel, they have been using a lot of road tubeless, so that new riders know how hard can be to fit a tyre. Let alone to try and make it seal on both sides.
    Andrea "Gattonero" Cattolico, head mechanic @Condor Cycles London


    "Caron, non ti crucciare:
    vuolsi così colà dove si puote
    ciò che si vuole, e più non dimandare"

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    Default Re: Tubeless valves

    Quote Originally Posted by Gattonero View Post
    They never had the joy of fitting 20mm clinchers (or unstretched Conti Track tubs on Pista wheels, for that matter) on those very shallow rims that were so common in that day. You remember those with an ERD no less than 615mm for a 700c, yes?
    And because history can be cruel, they have been using a lot of road tubeless, so that new riders know how hard can be to fit a tyre. Let alone to try and make it seal on both sides.
    I bought a used set of Campy Neutrons that had 23mm wire bead Gatorskin tires. I just want to meet the person who got them on, not shake hands because my hand might not survive.
    Weight Doper

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    Default Re: Tubeless valves

    Quote Originally Posted by bigbill View Post
    I bought a used set of Campy Neutrons that had 23mm wire bead Gatorskin tires. I just want to meet the person who got them on, not shake hands because my hand might not survive.
    Yeah, those could be tight but still far from fitting an unstretched tub on Campag Pista wheels: you know it's tight when the rest of the tub is on and the last bit is becoming a tangent to the rim at 10:10!
    Andrea "Gattonero" Cattolico, head mechanic @Condor Cycles London


    "Caron, non ti crucciare:
    vuolsi così colà dove si puote
    ciò che si vuole, e più non dimandare"

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    Default Re: Tubeless valves

    Quote Originally Posted by Gattonero View Post
    Yeah, those could be tight but still far from fitting an unstretched tub on Campag Pista wheels: you know it's tight when the rest of the tub is on and the last bit is becoming a tangent to the rim at 10:10!
    All good examples, usually made harder by the fact that you still have to get an unpunctured tube in that tiny carcass.

    Still, Andrew is right, and most died-in-the-wool roadies will never know: Cushcore and a two-ply casing wins every time. Possibly the hardest I’ve ever sweated indoors without doing dry land ski training in the living room with my kids.
     

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    Default Re: Tubeless valves

    Buy some good lightweight inner tubes like Schwalbe or the Panaracer r'airs. Tubeless is a shuck, a jive, and a fraud, at best it's a prank by tire companies to make tubulars look more user friendly.
     

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    Default Re: Tubeless valves

    Pre stretch! Save some old beater wheels for tire storage.
     

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    Default Re: Tubeless valves

    Quote Originally Posted by Vancouverdave View Post
    Pre stretch! Save some old beater wheels for tire storage.
    That's what old, shallow rims are kept for.
    Vittoria tubs can do without pre-stretch but Conti's do and especially their track ones are quite tight to boot.
    Andrea "Gattonero" Cattolico, head mechanic @Condor Cycles London


    "Caron, non ti crucciare:
    vuolsi così colà dove si puote
    ciò che si vuole, e più non dimandare"

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