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Thread: FYI Chris King 12 speed Campag - No go

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    Default FYI Chris King 12 speed Campag - No go

    Hi - passing along a small bit of information that may be useful. I was looking to build a set of wheels with CK R45 for an incoming frame getting 12 speed Campag. I e-mailed them about lockring specifications (their Campag hubs all need proprietary CK lockring ). Got a quick and informative reply - their current Campy R45 hubs are not compatible with 12 speed Campag at all. Thought this might save someone from building a set of wheels they can't use.
    Lou D'Amelio
    Bucks County PA

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    Default Re: FYI Chris King 12 speed Campag - No go

    I don't have much campagnolo come through my stand anymore, but I have not heard this. You may want to reach out to the AC boys and see what they found. Here's a 12speed on r45's: Bike of the Week: An Orange Steel Sprinter – Above Category Cycling
    So I say to youth right now. Don't sway to the unjust,
    no matter what they say, never give in.

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    Default Re: FYI Chris King 12 speed Campag - No go

    You cray cray. At least I’m pretty sure. No such thing as 12 speed Campy shell... it’s the same as 11 speed.

    Super Record 12 Speed sprockets - Components Campagnolo
     

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    Default Re: FYI Chris King 12 speed Campag - No go

    The freehub is the same from 10-12 Campagnolo version. Not sure why the King hub wouldn't work, but if that's the answer they gave then there most be some problem. Perhaps it's a hub flange spacing issue?

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    Default Re: FYI Chris King 12 speed Campag - No go

    Quote Originally Posted by Drew View Post
    No such thing as 12 speed Campy shell... it’s the same as 11 speed.

    Super Record 12 Speed sprockets - Components Campagnolo
    The freehub is the same dimensions.

    Funny enough, none of the wheel listings on the Campag website have their detailed specs updated to indicate they work with 12 speeds!

    -g
    EPOst hoc ergo propter hoc

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    Default Re: FYI Chris King 12 speed Campag - No go

    The non-compatibility of CK45 with 12 speed came directly from them in an e-mail responding to my question about lock ring choice. I'm not doubting that someone may have made it work. WI reports full compatibility, but it was about five weeks after I asked. I wound up going with Neutron Ultras anyway. Hard to beat.
    Lou D'Amelio
    Bucks County PA

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    Default Re: FYI Chris King 12 speed Campag - No go

    Quote Originally Posted by ldamelio View Post
    The non-compatibility of CK45 with 12 speed came directly from them in an e-mail responding to my question about lock ring choice. I'm not doubting that someone may have made it work. WI reports full compatibility, but it was about five weeks after I asked. I wound up going with Neutron Ultras anyway. Hard to beat.
    Did they run out of Boras?

    Kidding. Enjoy your new wheels
     

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    Default Re: FYI Chris King 12 speed Campag - No go

    Quote Originally Posted by Drew View Post
    Did they run out of Boras?

    Kidding. Enjoy your new wheels
    Got 'em already (tubular 50's) :}
    Lou D'Amelio
    Bucks County PA

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    Default Re: FYI Chris King 12 speed Campag - No go

    Quote Originally Posted by abbeyQ View Post
    The freehub is the same from 10-12 Campagnolo version. Not sure why the King hub wouldn't work, but if that's the answer they gave then there most be some problem. Perhaps it's a hub flange spacing issue?
    A poster across the hall with hub and cassette in hand stated it's a flange spacing issue. Not an issue with the lockring. Apparently the cassette mounts more or less properly but the backside of the cassette rubs the spokes.

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    Default Re: FYI Chris King 12 speed Campag - No go

    Quote Originally Posted by ryker View Post
    A poster across the hall with hub and cassette in hand stated it's a flange spacing issue. Not an issue with the lockring. Apparently the cassette mounts more or less properly but the backside of the cassette rubs the spokes.
    What depth rim and what type of spokes? A shallow alloy rim with round-section spokes will have far less clearance than a deep section carbon rim with bladed spokes

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    Default Re: FYI Chris King 12 speed Campag - No go

    Quote Originally Posted by Tristan View Post
    What depth rim and what type of spokes? A shallow alloy rim with round-section spokes will have far less clearance than a deep section carbon rim with bladed spokes
    Enve 3.4 with Sapim CX Ray spokes
     

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    Default Re: FYI Chris King 12 speed Campag - No go

    It looks like the cassette may be modifiable — there are ears on the backside that may be ground off. I haven't seen an explanation for their presence but speculate they're an overshift chain catcher system.

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    Default Re: FYI Chris King 12 speed Campag - No go

    Quote Originally Posted by ryker View Post
    I haven't seen an explanation for their presence but speculate they're an overshift chain catcher system.
    Affirmative.

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    Default Re: FYI Chris King 12 speed Campag - No go

    I have seen setups where the first sprocket will rub onto the Rh outbound spokes under load.
    When fighting for every 10th of a mm anything can cause problems.
    Andrea "Gattonero" Cattolico, head mechanic @Condor Cycles London


    "Caron, non ti crucciare:
    vuolsi così colà dove si puote
    ciò che si vuole, e più non dimandare"

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    Default Re: FYI Chris King 12 speed Campag - No go

    Quote Originally Posted by Gattonero View Post
    I have seen setups where the first sprocket will rub onto the Rh outbound spokes under load.
    When fighting for every 10th of a mm anything can cause problems.
    Total interference with outbound spoke, without load, here.
     

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    Default Re: FYI Chris King 12 speed Campag - No go

    Good to know, all the ones I've build up so far have been on Bora's or the likes.
    Andrea "Gattonero" Cattolico, head mechanic @Condor Cycles London


    "Caron, non ti crucciare:
    vuolsi così colà dove si puote
    ciò che si vuole, e più non dimandare"

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    Default Re: FYI Chris King 12 speed Campag - No go

    Has anyone had any additional experiences with this? I’d like to try 12 speed Chorus on a Pacenti SL23 28h laced to Campy R45. My current 11spd 12-27 has good clearance with the spokes. I would be trying the 11-29 12 speed cassette.

    I see that CK has removed all the R45 Campagnolo hubs from their site. I assume they will have a new Campy R45 available at some point?
     

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    Default Re: FYI Chris King 12 speed Campag - No go

    Quote Originally Posted by Msriddle View Post
    I see that CK has removed all the R45 Campagnolo hubs from their site. I assume they will have a new Campy R45 available at some point?
    King are going through a phase of heavily reducing the number of products they make. If the Campag stuff has vanished from their website I'd suspect that means it has been cut from the line - not surprising considering how little of it they must sell, how many of the freehub bodies broke, and how complicated fitting a Campagnolo freehub body to their hubs is.

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    Default Re: FYI Chris King 12 speed Campag - No go

    Quote Originally Posted by Tristan View Post
    King are going through a phase of heavily reducing the number of products they make. If the Campag stuff has vanished from their website I'd suspect that means it has been cut from the line - not surprising considering how little of it they must sell, how many of the freehub bodies broke, and how complicated fitting a Campagnolo freehub body to their hubs is.
    I'd be surprised if they're going to remove the Campagnolo compatibility, for what I know Chris himself rides Campag stuff.
    They've an even higher price tag in UK for the Campagnolo freehub option, but they do sell a few.

    As far as breakages, it was the aluminium version of the Campag freehub that could crack, once replaced with the stainless option there's never been a problem. And they're very easy to fit: push the Lh axle cap from the driveside with a long allen key, unscrew the Lh adjuster ring, slide out the axle/freehub assembly, slide out the freehub from the axle, that's all.
    Andrea "Gattonero" Cattolico, head mechanic @Condor Cycles London


    "Caron, non ti crucciare:
    vuolsi così colà dove si puote
    ciò che si vuole, e più non dimandare"

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    Default Re: FYI Chris King 12 speed Campag - No go

    By "complicated" I meant the parts required, not the procedure, but I was super unclear :-) If 12 speed doesn't fit on all King hub that means *another* Campagnolo freehub body design and knowing King they'll make a different axle as well.

    We've had a couple of the steel freehub bodies crack in the same way the aluminium ones did. The King bearings are just too large and the material is too thin.

    Campag used to be 30% of our wheelbuilds and it's now way less than 1% and the way the market is heading into gravel and 1x I can't see that getting bigger any time soon.



    Quote Originally Posted by Gattonero View Post
    I'd be surprised if they're going to remove the Campagnolo compatibility, for what I know Chris himself rides Campag stuff.
    They've an even higher price tag in UK for the Campagnolo freehub option, but they do sell a few.

    As far as breakages, it was the aluminium version of the Campag freehub that could crack, once replaced with the stainless option there's never been a problem. And they're very easy to fit: push the Lh axle cap from the driveside with a long allen key, unscrew the Lh adjuster ring, slide out the axle/freehub assembly, slide out the freehub from the axle, that's all.

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