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View Poll Results: Will you take the vaccine as soon as it is made available to your category?

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  • Yes

    101 84.87%
  • No

    18 15.13%
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Thread: The Vaccine Thread

  1. #281
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    Default Re: It's all good.

    I just realized that I have more apps for trying to find an appointment (NYC, NYS, NYU, Columbia Pres, and more) which I can not find, than I have apps for cycling and skiing added together. And none of them have a way to notify you when there is one available. Oh, NYS did say I could have an appointment on March 10 in Potsdam NY which is 430 miles away so I guess I am overstating the no appointments thing. Not. It is totally fubared.
    « If I knew what I was doing, I’d be doing it right now »

    -Jon Mandel

  2. #282
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    Default Re: It's all good.

    My 83 year old father is getting nothing but no's in Virginia.
    Jorn Ake
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  3. #283
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    Default Re: It's all good.

    I received an e-mail from my health care provider today offering an appointment this Thursday to receive the Covid 19 vaccine. The day after the inauguration. Coincidence? I think not, thanks Joe!

  4. #284
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    Default Re: It's all good.

    95 yo Mother-in-law and 85 yo Mother in PA...nada. 32 yo niece who is an event planner at a hospital in MT...fully vaccinated.
    rw saunders
    hey, how lucky can one man get.

  5. #285
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    Default Re: It's all good.

    Quote Originally Posted by htwoopup View Post
    I just realized that I have more apps for trying to find an appointment (NYC, NYS, NYU, Columbia Pres, and more) which I can not find, than I have apps for cycling and skiing added together. And none of them have a way to notify you when there is one available. Oh, NYS did say I could have an appointment on March 10 in Potsdam NY which is 430 miles away so I guess I am overstating the no appointments thing. Not. It is totally fubared.
    Apps aren't going to cut it, at least not until the new administration gains some oversight and traction on the whole process. If you have friends in healthcare and are in one of the currently eligible groups, leveraging your network is you best bet for the near term future.

    Second dose update: pretty much back to normal at 36 hours. It was reasonably unpleasant at 24 hours and seemed to start breaking at about 30 hours. YMMV. I chronicled this here hoping it's useful as a lot of us here are in the same demographic (old guys who like metal bikes!) and have similar active lifestyles.

    And I'll end with a rant - smokers are a high risk priority group in NJ - a 21 year old smoker is eligible. Eff me. Wrong on so many levels. I could get my 30-something kids shots just by sticking a pack of Marlboros in their sleeves. I won't. Hippocratic oath, distributive justice and all that.
    Lou D'Amelio
    Bucks County PA

  6. #286
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    Default Re: It's all good.

    F-
    I'm P-d
    But I'm still a privileged white boy with adequate insurance.
    There is no fair and democratic sign up or line up for those wanting the shot.
    There is only a competition among those in your own community.
    F.

  7. #287
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    Default Re: It's all good.

    Thanks for sharing your experience Dr. D'Amelio!

    My K12 RN wife spent a long time on-line searching for a vaccine spot yesterday, and has an appt on Feb 5th, about an hour outside Boston. I'll be driving.
    GO!

  8. #288
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    Default Re: It's all good.

    My daughter got the first one yesterday. She's a caseworker in an addiction treatment facility. 22.
    Jay Dwight

  9. #289
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    Default Re: It's all good.

    Quote Originally Posted by ldamelio View Post
    Apps aren't going to cut it, at least not until the new administration gains some oversight and traction on the whole process. If you have friends in healthcare and are in one of the currently eligible groups, leveraging your network is you best bet for the near term future.

    Second dose update: pretty much back to normal at 36 hours. It was reasonably unpleasant at 24 hours and seemed to start breaking at about 30 hours. YMMV. I chronicled this here hoping it's useful as a lot of us here are in the same demographic (old guys who like metal bikes!) and have similar active lifestyles.

    And I'll end with a rant - smokers are a high risk priority group in NJ - a 21 year old smoker is eligible. Eff me. Wrong on so many levels. I could get my 30-something kids shots just by sticking a pack of Marlboros in their sleeves. I won't. Hippocratic oath, distributive justice and all that.
    who knew that smokers had advocates in high places? From the WaPo

    "This would not be a group that would bubble up to high priority,” Eric Topol, a cardiologist and the founder and director of the Scripps Research Translational Institute, told The Washington Post. “Just smoking doesn’t cut it in my view,” arguing that only smokers also suffering from a chronic respiratory condition should get early vaccines.
    Later on in this article, we have this gem

    But Esther Choo, an emergency physician and professor at Oregon Health and Science University, says it’s wrong to de-prioritize smokers or others with substance abuse.

    “There’s a very steep and judgmental slippery slope when we start to say that one group or the other does not deserve vaccines based on your health behavior, particularly when we understand smoking to be a substance use disorder,” Choo told The Post.

    She added, “It’s a nuanced and balanced decision, but I actually agree with considering high-risk factors when it comes to vaccine prioritizing, and smoking is a high-risk factor.”

    But Topol said many smokers don’t actually have the underlying medical issues that would put them at higher risk of covid-19 complications.

    “Just being a smoker without chronic obstructive lung disease, that isn’t considered a coexisting condition,” he said. “It doesn’t deserve special priority in my view. If they have lung disease, asthma, diabetes, that’s a different matter.”

  10. #290
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    Default Re: It's all good.

    One consistent set of standards would help a whole lot for sure. There's a lot that should go into it but the bottom line should be how likely you are to be completely f-ed up by it because you can't fight it off well and how likely you are to be a vessel for it and give it the opportunity to mutate because it has a lot of hosts to work with, whether you yourself can kick it down after a week to 10 days. That's my opinion but I am not an ethicist. Hell, I have no sense of ethics so my other senses are enhanced. Take it for what its worth.

    Our anecdotes are that Karen's brother who is the chief HVAC control system guy at the big regional here got an email telling him show up and get vaccinated so he did. He said he feels guilty but he wasn't going to make a fuss. He said he was going to fuss if the housekeeping and dietary staff weren't there but they were so he felt better. He got his second shot yesterday and he said he had a fever in the first 24 hours but so far nothing else. He says what makes him really insane is how many of his staff refused the vaccine because they think it'll break their DNA.

    Karen's mom is 89 years old and Karen sat on some web site for two hours this weekend until she got an appointment on March 5th in Utica, about a 60 minute drive from here. Well, 80-90 if Karen drives but if I'm behind the wheel of the Swedish Warbird passengers will barely have time to finish a sandwich.

    Karen thinks I should be eligible early because of a couple rounds with cancer and other stuff but that's where I think lifestyle ought to count. I work from home and I go to the grocery once a week masked to the point where my eyes aren't showing and I take pains to stay the hell away from anybody there. My exposure is about nil, I think somebody with a similar health and age profile that actually works for a living ought to get extra points and go first.
    Tom Ambros

  11. #291
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    Default Re: It's all good.

    My parents, along with thousands of others, just had their appointments at the largest hospital system in town cancelled. Turns out they don't have enough doses. By booking an appointment with this hospital they didn't pursue other available avenues and now we can't find them an appointment anywhere. So much for having some relief.
    "I guess you're some weird relic of an obsolete age." - davids

  12. #292
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    Default Re: It's all good.

    Quote Originally Posted by Matthew Strongin View Post
    My parents, along with thousands of others, just had their appointments at the largest hospital system in town cancelled. Turns out they don't have enough doses. By booking an appointment with this hospital they didn't pursue other available avenues and now we can't find them an appointment anywhere. So much for having some relief.
    I can't like your comment, but I do feel your pain.
    There is no button for that.

  13. #293
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    Default Re: It's all good.

    I know there are logistical problems/failures/disasters the US has to overcome, but I also see that Italy is considering legal action against Pfizer for significant under-delivery. It's not clear to me if that means this is a production issue in addition to a distribution issue. If so, were the production goals realistic in the first place?
    Dan Fuller, local bicycle enthusiast

  14. #294
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    Default Re: It's all good.

    Our health department launched a registration site this morning at 8:00 am. It had the normal issues with too much traffic, but seems to be working now. I'm registered, it is still based on phases, now I'm supposed to be notified when my "group" is up and there is a vaccine with my name on it. We'll see how this goes.

  15. #295
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    Default Re: It's all good.

    And another thing that I don’t understand (although my not understanding/ frustration may be heightened because it is personal)...in some places Type 2 diabetics are eligible but Type 1 (which my daughter has been she was 2 years old and is thus HIGHLY in danger. Two of her Type 1 friends she met through doing work for the JDRF have died from Covid) is not eligible for the vaccine yet.
    « If I knew what I was doing, I’d be doing it right now »

    -Jon Mandel

  16. #296
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    Default Re: It's all good.

    Its getting to the point where it feels like we are letting perfect be the enemy of good.

    We are struggling as "frontline" educators are in the next priority group. We attempted to work with county health to vaccinate at district offices but the hospitals (jargon: the multi-county health orgs) do not want to do that. Not all of our workers are served by the same system, and the system can't tell the difference between a teacher who has been teaching students in person since november and the assessment administrator who will never see a kid in person and has no real reason to not work remotely. So everyone is super scared about the "wrong" people getting jabbed first. The result as of two days ago is: 3.23MM full courses distributed in CA, 1.39MM doses administered.

    I really think we need to be more OK with some "undeserving" folks getting in the mix to just get things moving. Let the gods, karma, or Raskolnikov's journey sort it out later.

  17. #297
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    Default Re: It's all good.

    Quote Originally Posted by spopepro View Post
    Its getting to the point where it feels like we are letting perfect be the enemy of good.

    We are struggling as "frontline" educators are in the next priority group. We attempted to work with county health to vaccinate at district offices but the hospitals (jargon: the multi-county health orgs) do not want to do that. Not all of our workers are served by the same system, and the system can't tell the difference between a teacher who has been teaching students in person since november and the assessment administrator who will never see a kid in person and has no real reason to not work remotely. So everyone is super scared about the "wrong" people getting jabbed first. The result as of two days ago is: 3.23MM full courses distributed in CA, 1.39MM doses administered.

    I really think we need to be more OK with some "undeserving" folks getting in the mix to just get things moving. Let the gods, karma, or Raskolnikov's journey sort it out later.
    I agree. I've been saying the same thing for at least a week. The goal is to get this into as many arms as quickly as possible and on average to have the first people be members of more vulnerable populations. It shouldn't be a deal breaker if a clerical error or oversight results in a young and healthy person get a month earlier than ideal.

  18. #298
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    Default Re: It's all good.

    Quote Originally Posted by spopepro View Post
    Its getting to the point where it feels like we are letting perfect be the enemy of good.

    We are struggling as "frontline" educators are in the next priority group. We attempted to work with county health to vaccinate at district offices but the hospitals (jargon: the multi-county health orgs) do not want to do that. Not all of our workers are served by the same system, and the system can't tell the difference between a teacher who has been teaching students in person since november and the assessment administrator who will never see a kid in person and has no real reason to not work remotely. So everyone is super scared about the "wrong" people getting jabbed first. The result as of two days ago is: 3.23MM full courses distributed in CA, 1.39MM doses administered.

    I really think we need to be more OK with some "undeserving" folks getting in the mix to just get things moving. Let the gods, karma, or Raskolnikov's journey sort it out later.
    Totally agree. What I don’t understand is the inconsistency in the overthink. I think the overthink is creating some of the problems. Why not do all immune compromised/ auto immune disease people as a larger cohort? I think the more lines there are between « types of eligibility » the more you set the system up for problems. Why is it that in some jurisdictions different types of people/ centers can give a vaccine while in others the equivalent peers can not give a vaccine? (This was always something that amazed me when my kid was in grade school..I had to go to school at lunchtime to give her her insulin injection. The school had to have a nurse who had to be an RN but the nurse was forbidden to give an injection.)

    While I recognize that this is a massive undertaking, the inconsistencies (such as number of doses in LA vs NYC vs Montana...i don’t mean that in the sense of one opposed to the other but in the relativity thing...)makes no sense to the math side of my brain. Why is Pfizer now realizing that they have to slow deliveries so that they can upgrade their production? That seems to be an error. Why did they make it so hard in some areas (NYC/NY State) to hunt down an available vaccine and why is it mainly online and isn’t this a problem for some of the most vulnerable in even knowing how/having the ability to access the systems?

    I get that hindsight is 20/20 but so much that is wrong just seems to be logistics 101 simple stuff to have set up right in the beginning....I mean you had a year to do it. That’s not just the former TV actor and now former President, it is a failure throughout.
    « If I knew what I was doing, I’d be doing it right now »

    -Jon Mandel

  19. #299
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    Default Re: It's all good.

    My reading of footprints and tea leaves is that the smart people in the know who are running this with appropriate professionalism are not expecting a dependable supply of vaccines for months. So put as many needles into the arms of people with the highest exposure so we don't run out of medical professionals. Anything leftover goes to the most vulnerable health-wise. One round of vaccinations is better than no round of vaccinations so use up everything you've got and fingers crossed for the next shipment to arrive before everyone has to be redone from the get-go.

    Meanwhile Michigan and Maine got shipments of Moderna that had spoiled. 16,000 doses off the table.

    NY cancelled 23,000 appointments due to additional Moderna delays.

    I know there are a lot of expressions of optimism about the vaccines and turning the corner, but there are some significant issues that need to get solved in the first quarter of the year.
    Jorn Ake
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  20. #300
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    Default Re: It's all good.

    Quote Originally Posted by j44ke View Post
    My reading of footprints and tea leaves is that the smart people in the know who are running this with appropriate professionalism are not expecting a dependable supply of vaccines for months. So put as many needles into the arms of people with the highest exposure so we don't run out of medical professionals. Anything leftover goes to the most vulnerable health-wise. One round of vaccinations is better than no round of vaccinations so use up everything you've got and fingers crossed for the next shipment to arrive before everyone has to be redone from the get-go.

    Meanwhile Michigan and Maine got shipments of Moderna that had spoiled. 16,000 doses off the table.

    NY cancelled 23,000 appointments due to additional Moderna delays.

    I know there are a lot of expressions of optimism about the vaccines and turning the corner, but there are some significant issues that need to get solved in the first quarter of the year.
    There are more issues than one may anticipate. We have severe flooding in many areas of the UK, including York.

    "Wrexham council leader Mark Pritchard said teams worked to ensure the Oxford-AstraZeneca vaccine, made on Wrexham Industrial Estate, was not lost in the floods.

    Mr Pritchard told BBC Radio Wales: "We had an incident at Wrexham Industrial Estate, the Oxford vaccination is produced there and the warehouse where it is stored, obviously I can't tell you where it is, but we had to work in partnership to make sure we didn't lose the vaccinations in the floods.

    "I've been up all night... it's a very difficult time for us.""

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-55745714

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