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Thread: How Moderates Failed Black America

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    Default How Moderates Failed Black America

    Better education is not leading to equality.

    More...
     

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    Default Re: How Moderates Failed Black America

    Moderate voters, and neo-liberal politicians haven't failed only black America, though they've certainly done that, they've failed all but the very richest. They've been fabulous for the uber wealthy and entrenched corporate interests. It doesn't matter if power and wealth was concentrated within royalty, as in Europe in centuries of yore, or grotesquely wealthy corporations and individuals in the present; the result is unstable, untenable and if not rectified via peaceful means will lead to violent revolution. I certainly don't want it to come to that but if the country doesn't change tack pretty soon I think it will, and I don't see how it would be anything but extraordinarily bloody.

    There's a reason that the Democratic Party is accused of being the party of fake left, go right; but at least there is a vibrant progressive movement within it that is working to bend the trajectory.
    John Clay
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    Default Re: How Moderates Failed Black America

    John, were does my pet wish of a WPA jobs program fit into this? Answer, where doesn't it fit.

    Let me count the ways.

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    Default Re: How Moderates Failed Black America

    There is starting to be talk of cities and states starting their own WPA style programs. But most of them are way short of cash right now so the gop federal road block will likely force more pain until they are removed...

    As cool as WPA style programs are I'm excited by the call for CCC style programs. Start to clean up the environmental mess created over the last 3.5 years...
    Last edited by guido; 1 Week Ago at 09:41 PM.
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    Default Re: How Moderates Failed Black America

    Quote Originally Posted by Too Tall View Post
    John, were does my pet wish of a WPA jobs program fit into this? Answer, where doesn't it fit.

    Let me count the ways.
    If the thought is how can we nationalize the productive capacity of under-employed and willing-to-work citizens to do good work that benefits society at large - bring it!

    .
    .
    .

    And include the arts...
    Kirk MRB | ???

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    Default Re: How Moderates Failed Black America

    Quote Originally Posted by admin View Post
    Better education is not leading to equality.

    More...
    Watched this the other day - hit on similar themes, and without the soft-paywall or annoyance of all things David Brooks..

    Kirk MRB | ???

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    Default Re: How Moderates Failed Black America

    Quote Originally Posted by admin View Post
    Better education is not leading to equality.

    More...
    I would say it helps but you cannot reverse the pot in only one generation. Also, better education is also accessible education and I have the feeling cost wise this is not the case in the USA hence the mention on the burden on loans for black students. I have two kids and I cannot imagine them starting their work life with a debt.
    --
    T h o m a s

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    Default Re: How Moderates Failed Black America

    Quote Originally Posted by Clean39T View Post
    If the thought is how can we nationalize the productive capacity of under-employed and willing-to-work citizens to do good work that benefits society at large - bring it!

    .
    .
    .

    And include the arts...
    Absolutely the arts.

    More on the cities with plans for WPA/CCC style programs please. Links?

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    Default Re: How Moderates Failed Black America

    Quote Originally Posted by Too Tall View Post
    Absolutely the arts.

    More on the cities with plans for WPA/CCC style programs please. Links?
    Do you think the underemployed have the skillsets that the WPC and CCC folks had during the depression? I live in a town on Rt66, most of the sidewalks downtown have a WPA stamp on them. The Oatman Highway which is the old Rt66 between Kingman and the Colorado River has revetments built by CCC and WPA. The concrete and stone walls along the road have WPA markings. The same thing with the National and State Parks, if they existed in the 20s and 30s, chances are that much of the existing infrastructure was CCC. Can the nation or states fashion a new style of WPA that teaches and provides employment, that is the question. For the old CCC and WPA, that is construction, who is building our houses and roads these days? It is not underemployed Americans, that is why I bring up the skillset question.
    Weight Doper

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    Default Re: How Moderates Failed Black America

    Quote Originally Posted by bigbill View Post
    Do you think the underemployed have the skillsets that the WPC and CCC folks had during the depression? I live in a town on Rt66, most of the sidewalks downtown have a WPA stamp on them. The Oatman Highway which is the old Rt66 between Kingman and the Colorado River has revetments built by CCC and WPA. The concrete and stone walls along the road have WPA markings. The same thing with the National and State Parks, if they existed in the 20s and 30s, chances are that much of the existing infrastructure was CCC. Can the nation or states fashion a new style of WPA that teaches and provides employment, that is the question. For the old CCC and WPA, that is construction, who is building our houses and roads these days? It is not underemployed Americans, that is why I bring up the skillset question.
    I have faith in people to listen, learn and earn. The model was and hopefully will be to teach skills and pass on the knowledge of work ethic and excellence. The workers who came out of CC/WPA went on to build new businesses, raise families yada yada yada.

    There is something fundamentally right about earning a paycheck which goes hand in hand with self esteem that leads to better lives.

    I've worked some seriously basic jobs in my life. The simple act of doing (whatever) a job well has everlasting impacts on my life even if the job seemed insignificant or menial at the time.

    Giving people work, paying them for it and allowing them the joy of owning their lives is, to coin a worn phrase, priceless.

    So give me a fukin' shovel and point me at that pile. I love to work.

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    Default Re: How Moderates Failed Black America

    The WPA spent beaucoup dollars on materials if I remember correctly. That was part of the approach. Stimulus at all levels. The amazing granite that pre-depression was going into the homes of the robber barons then went into bridges, parks and municipal buildings built by the WPA.

    Also the high level of unemployment meant that many very highly skilled workers were also available. I think there is some truth to the project taking relatively unskilled workers and teaching them a trade, but there were also some very highly skilled people working with the WPA. And labor costs before the Depression were low - the 1950ís and 60ís was the labor movement era - so during the Depression there was even less competition on wages. The government hired a lot of people but they also had the luxury of available skilled workers.

    And it was also a time and a place that coincided with a vision of America and civic duty.

    Thereís a book...canít remember the title...
    Last edited by j44ke; 1 Week Ago at 08:33 AM.
     

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    Default Re: How Moderates Failed Black America

    Quote Originally Posted by Too Tall View Post
    I have faith in people to listen, learn and earn. The model was and hopefully will be to teach skills and pass on the knowledge of work ethic and excellence. The workers who came out of CC/WPA went on to build new businesses, raise families yada yada yada.

    There is something fundamentally right about earning a paycheck which goes hand in hand with self esteem that leads to better lives.

    I've worked some seriously basic jobs in my life. The simple act of doing (whatever) a job well has everlasting impacts on my life even if the job seemed insignificant or menial at the time.

    Giving people work, paying them for it and allowing them the joy of owning their lives is, to coin a worn phrase, priceless.

    So give me a fukin' shovel and point me at that pile. I love to work.
    I think the reality of the CCC/WPA has been glossed up over time. I think it was much harsher than we imagine. Instead of using a bulldozer, let's give 1000 men shovels.

    The real benefit of the CCC may have been in giving some really impoverished youth in rural areas a chance to get out. I believe these youth also had a chance at education in the camps.
    If you want to use a new camp for social engineering, then by all means do. You can take the under educated, the homeless out of the cities, move them to camps, out of sight out of mind... detox them, teach them discipline, and maybe even educate. A few eggs get busted in the process. . .

    That's what really happens and probably needs to happen

    Weren't the CCC camps run by the Army and prior to WW2, the largest mobilization of American men?
     

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    Default Re: How Moderates Failed Black America

    Yes on education. One of the reasons there were so many military training films made pre and during WWII was the literacy rate was something like 75% and less than that in rural areas. So talking pictures instead of reading manuals.
     

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