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Thread: Let's talk about the history of "Modern Doping"

  1. #41
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    Default Re: Let's talk about the history of "Modern Doping"

    When was the test taken though? I was looking at the 92-94 period. Pretty sure it was in a magazine article and possibly in an interview/feature with LA.
     

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    Default Re: Let's talk about the history of "Modern Doping"

    Did they have dimples back then ?
    Friends don't let friends ride clinchers

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    Default Re: Let's talk about the history of "Modern Doping"

    Lemond was known to be virtually off the charts with talent. This is why he is so pissed off at LA, who was not on the same charts as GL and should never have produced such prodigious results.

    For those who didn't follow the sport in the early '80s, Greg Lemond was truly the Wunderkind of his generation, not a cranky 50 year old of today. He was talented and motivated and had the backing it took. He rode away from the nation's best when he was like 16. A couple years later he was riding away from the best pros and in 1983 he confirmed it with a Worlds victory. In 1984 he was third in the Tour and the following year by all accounts might have won the TdF were it not for internal team issues. In 1986 he won. So his progression was rapid and to the top of the sport.

    I'm a huge fan of GL.
     

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    Default Re: Let's talk about the history of "Modern Doping"

    Quote Originally Posted by Saab2000 View Post
    Lemond was known to be virtually off the charts with talent. This is why he is so pissed off at LA, who was not on the same charts as GL and should never have produced such prodigious results.

    For those who didn't follow the sport in the early '80s, Greg Lemond was truly the Wunderkind of his generation, not a cranky 50 year old of today. He was talented and motivated and had the backing it took. He rode away from the nation's best when he was like 16. A couple years later he was riding away from the best pros and in 1983 he confirmed it with a Worlds victory. In 1984 he was third in the Tour and the following year by all accounts might have one the TdF were it not for internal team issues. In 1986 he won. So his progression was rapid and to the top of the sport.

    I'm a huge fan of GL.

    Not to mention the time that he lost to the gunshot wound at the peak of his career.
     

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    Default Re: Let's talk about the history of "Modern Doping"

    I just want to chime in and say this is a great thread. That is all.
    There is water at the bottom of the ocean.

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    Default Re: Let's talk about the history of "Modern Doping"

    gl fan here.
    someone dig up the finish of the jr worlds rr.. i thk it was in s america..
    lemond ( as i remember ) was awarded the win after dejokeere crashed him once, put him into the barriers once and crashed him again..
    each time lemond came back and was going to beat him.
    it was a legendary race finish.
     

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    Default Re: Let's talk about the history of "Modern Doping"

    Quote Originally Posted by SteveP View Post
    gl fan here.
    someone dig up the finish of the jr worlds rr.. i thk it was in s america..
    lemond ( as i remember ) was awarded the win after dejokeere crashed him once, put him into the barriers once and crashed him again..
    each time lemond came back and was going to beat him.
    it was a legendary race finish.

    it was kenny demertiererrelellllere atmo.

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    Default Re: Let's talk about the history of "Modern Doping"

    Quote Originally Posted by SteveP View Post
    gl fan here.
    someone dig up the finish of the jr worlds rr.. i thk it was in s america..
    lemond ( as i remember ) was awarded the win after dejokeere crashed him once, put him into the barriers once and crashed him again..
    each time lemond came back and was going to beat him.
    it was a legendary race finish.
    a year or two before this happened, lemond was allowed to compete at the selection races for the junior world's team - even though, at 16, he was too young to be allowed to compete.

    he won maybe four out of the six races and placed in the other two, iirc. and he couldn't go...
    Steve Hampsten
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    Default Re: Let's talk about the history of "Modern Doping"

    re the lemond years - if you didn't witness his rise and talent in real time you'll forever assume it should rival lance's.
    but it doesn't - it surpasses it in spades atmo. lemond can and did it all. if - IF - he lived in an era where only one race
    was the season, who knows. but the induran years were the beginning of a rider focusing on an event rather than on
    the racing season.

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    Default Re: Let's talk about the history of "Modern Doping"

    Quote Originally Posted by Saab2000 View Post
    If there are scumbags in the machine, I don't think it's the riders. I like all the riders. Even Lance (sort of). After all, say what you will about him, he's an incredible rider and no matter what happens, he still has to pedal the bikes.
    I agree.
    The scum bags are the folks who charged with taking care of the national team and instead inject juniors, convince impressionable U-23's that "everyone is doing it," the agents/talent companies that aid in the process (biggest and baddest happens to be located in Switzerland...that did not happen by chance did it Tony?) and the company CEO's (one in particular I am thinking of is also based in Switzerland) who know better but allow it to go on instead of taking a stand.
    The riders are the victims- there are too many parallels to recreational drug users and PED users.
     

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    Default Re: Let's talk about the history of "Modern Doping"

    The scum bags<cut>.
    the folks in charge are all old racers atmo. if they didn't want to perpetuate a culture they wouldn't have their cronies from other professions in their pockets. cycling is an old sport. it's a pre-war, pre-tv, european sport with roots that go back a century. it's like boxing. it will never change. the delivery system may be modern - detached reporters who are looking for any story they can find, satellite transmissions, instant net results - but the stuff on the road and in the team cars is still the same as it was before merckx's era by a long shot

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    Default Re: Let's talk about the history of "Modern Doping"

    Quote Originally Posted by the bottle ride View Post
    The riders are the victims- there are too many parallels to recreational drug users and PED users.

    Really? You think so? Do you include alcohol and tobacco in the category of recreational drugs?
    There is water at the bottom of the ocean.

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    Default Re: Let's talk about the history of "Modern Doping"

    Quote Originally Posted by R.Liverman View Post
    Really? You think so? Do you include alcohol and tobacco in the category of recreational drugs?
    I meant just in terms of how it takes hold of the person- people feel like they need the drugs one way or another. Dopers feel the need to dope because they feel like everyone else is doing it, but then it turns into more of a need once they have experienced the performance differences.

    Do I think alcohol and tobacco fall into the category as a drug? Yes. Does it stop me from having a libation every once in awhile? No.
     

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    Default Re: Let's talk about the history of "Modern Doping"

    Quote Originally Posted by e-RICHIE View Post
    the folks in charge are all old racers atmo. if they didn't want to perpetuate a culture they wouldn't have their cronies from other professions in their pockets. cycling is an old sport. it's a pre-war, pre-tv, european sport with roots that go back a century. it's like boxing. it will never change. the delivery system may be modern - detached reporters who are looking for any story they can find, satellite transmissions, instant net results - but the stuff on the road and in the team cars is still the same as it was before merckx's era by a long shot

    this....... it is true. I've seen it. Still, the most beautiful sport there is.
     

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    Default Re: Let's talk about the history of "Modern Doping"

    Yup....



    I'm fairly convinced that this guy woulda been there for many, many years were it not for the Dick Cheney-like hunting accident and maybe other stuff. Who knows? But he was in a league of very, very few.

    BTW, I wonder who really built that bike?
     

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    Default Re: Let's talk about the history of "Modern Doping"

    Quote Originally Posted by TJ View Post
    I think we are in agreement, its not the riders its the machine. Modern era is what im referring to as the machine. I will also say I like Lance. Again, entertained the crap outta me. Vino as well. All just cogs in the machine that is modern era cycling which includes doping programs
    I think the difference is that LA is a part owner of the machine.
     

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    Default Re: Let's talk about the history of "Modern Doping"

    Aside from 3 Tours and 2 Worlds (a pretty big aside!), what else did Lemond win? Was he an all-arounder like Merckx or did he focus more on the Tours such that he presaged the Indurain/Armstrong one race years?

    And it seems he pre-dates EPO, finishing his career as that drug took hold of the peloton. But were there ever rumors at the time of Lemond being part of the speed and 'roids crowd?
     

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    Default Re: Let's talk about the history of "Modern Doping"

    Quote Originally Posted by nahtnoj View Post
    I think the difference is that LA is a part owner of the machine.
    this is true atmo. when weisel bankrolled his comeback he never anticipated the staying power and media attention. by
    win three of the usps/tdf era, the bracelet had taken over the company because they didn't have any way to pay him.

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    Default Re: Let's talk about the history of "Modern Doping"

    The always entertaining Steve Tilford, who has a ton of street cred, has this to say about Lemond (read the comments too): I’m sick of this “I train harder” thing
     

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    Default Re: Let's talk about the history of "Modern Doping"

    Quote Originally Posted by jitahs View Post
    The always entertaining Steve Tilford, who has a ton of street cred, has this to say about Lemond (read the comments too): I’m sick of this “I train harder” thing
    That was cool. I was at Kim West's (in the comments) wedding last summer...

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