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Thread: Always follow the money. Big Pharma and HGH

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    Default Always follow the money. Big Pharma and HGH

    Big pharma cashing in on HGH abuse - More Sports - SI.com

    (AP) -- A federal crackdown on illicit foreign supplies of human growth hormone has failed to stop rampant misuse, and instead has driven record sales of the drug by some of the world's biggest pharmaceutical companies, an Associated Press investigation shows.

    The crackdown, which began in 2006, reduced the illegal flow of unregulated supplies from China, India and Mexico.

    But since then, Big Pharma has been satisfying the steady desires of U.S. users and abusers, including many who take the drug in the false hope of delaying the effects of aging.

    From 2005 to 2011, inflation-adjusted sales of HGH were up 69 percent, according to an AP analysis of pharmaceutical company data collected by the research firm IMS Health. Sales of the average prescription drug rose just 12 percent in that same period.



    Read More: Big pharma cashing in on HGH abuse - More Sports - SI.com

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    Default Re: Always follow the money. Big Pharma and HGH

    I read this yesterday and to be honest it blew me away. I think I'm a little isolated up here in the woods, but 'ya know what, I like it that way! Actually the part of the article that floored me was seeing the medical issues that the folks who are taking this crap are having...the swollen joints and stuff. There are no short cuts! I just finished reading the book "Talent is Overrated", I liked it so much I got a copy for my boys, both in their 20's. It just was a great reminder to me that following your passions and being passionate about them, will get you very far in this world. Folks have to get rid of this notion that others have the "genes" or the "luck" and it's ok for them to take a short cut to catch up with them.


    Quote Originally Posted by vertical_doug View Post
    Big pharma cashing in on HGH abuse - More Sports - SI.com

    (AP) -- A federal crackdown on illicit foreign supplies of human growth hormone has failed to stop rampant misuse, and instead has driven record sales of the drug by some of the world's biggest pharmaceutical companies, an Associated Press investigation shows.

    The crackdown, which began in 2006, reduced the illegal flow of unregulated supplies from China, India and Mexico.

    But since then, Big Pharma has been satisfying the steady desires of U.S. users and abusers, including many who take the drug in the false hope of delaying the effects of aging.

    From 2005 to 2011, inflation-adjusted sales of HGH were up 69 percent, according to an AP analysis of pharmaceutical company data collected by the research firm IMS Health. Sales of the average prescription drug rose just 12 percent in that same period.



    Read More: Big pharma cashing in on HGH abuse - More Sports - SI.com

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    Default Re: Always follow the money. Big Pharma and HGH

    same thing happened with to the makers of Oxycontin; the trug wasn't tracked, it kept getting stolen from pharmacies and wholesalers, insurance claims were made, and voila!! the drug maker got to sell more Oxycontin to replace the stolen stock! The gun industry operates like this too; convince people they need guns to fight the bads guys...guns get stolen or sold...and oops! we better buy some more guns to protect ourselves with all the new guns the bad guys stole. More drugs and guns in circulation is a lovely combo.

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    Default Re: Always follow the money. Big Pharma and HGH

    HGH and steroid use is rampant. High school age athletes use them like they were normal. Yet the talkign heads and writers act like cycling is the dirtiest sport ever. That never fails to get my blood pressure up.
    Good cyclists are:
    Visible, Predictable, Alert, Assertive and Courteous

    They also use the five layers of protection available.
    Layer 1: Control your bike
    Layer 2: Know and follow the rules of the road
    Layer 3: Ride in the smartest lane position
    Layer 4: Manage hazards skillfully
    Layer 5: Utilize passive protection.

    Chris, Broussard, LA

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    Default Re: Always follow the money. Big Pharma and HGH

    Quote Originally Posted by bikinchris View Post
    HGH and steroid use is rampant. High school age athletes use them like they were normal. Yet the talkign heads and writers act like cycling is the dirtiest sport ever. That never fails to get my blood pressure up.
    Professional cycling is pretty much the dirtiest sport ever- for close to 30 years almost the entire pro peloton was/is doping.

    Not sure one can blame "big pharma" for HGH abuse- it is a legal drug with proven therapeutic benefits for those with certain conditions. Unless they are shipping it out the back door, then them the problem lies further down the supply chain (my guess is doctors writing prescriptions for those without legally qualifying conditions). The companies can't just stop making it as that would leave those with legitimate uses with a major problem.

    Now, I suppose you could make the argument that big pharma lobbied Washington to crack down on illegal imported HGH because it was cutting into its profit margins. Maybe that would almost have to be true since I can't think of another reason the government would waste time and money doing so.

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    Default Re: Always follow the money. Big Pharma and HGH

    as the title to the thread says, follow the money. The guys in baseball that were taking HGH made tons of money off of it. They seem to have cleaned up a bit and some high profile players have quit because they are worthless without it. I am pretty sure that football is the dirtiest sport at this point. Their drug control is a joke.

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    Default Re: Always follow the money. Big Pharma and HGH

    I don't have a link, but there was a pretty interesting article from, IIRC, Outdoor Magazine floating around about a 40-ish amateur cyclist who went out and tried all the popular PEDs just to write up his experiences. HGH came off the best of the lot, but what surprised me was his visit to a doctor with a waiting room full of Hollywood and pro sports types who were there for their HGH. The doc sounds like he was making a fortune off this - the cost was at least a few thousand a month.

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    Default Re: Always follow the money. Big Pharma and HGH

    It is a lot easier to blame "big pharma" than to find the docs prescribing the drug "off label" and enforcing laws on the books to prevent abuse. Off label is of course legal but not always appropriate. It is not the role of Big Pharma to chase these docs. In fact, in many places its an interaction that isn't permitted. Big Pharma finds out who prescribes which drugs the same way the authors of that artical did - via IMS. And they get their data from a few different ways of surveying docs and pharmacies. It's a odd part of the business.

    The big issue here is not the existence of a drug like HGH. For the very ill for which its indicated it is a life changer. The issue is jackholes trying to cheat nature and aging and docs who are profiting from this (growing) niche. Groups of docs at "clinics" like Cenegenics getting rich prescribing these drugs where they are not needed make me want to vomit. That isn't health care, it's sanctioned drug abuse for delusional high weatlh individuals.

    The Outside "doping" article is available online. It was interesting as a fluff piece and shows how effective these medicines can be at altering physiology. But the risks are not worth it for otherwise healthy people. Just go train and get what you get.

    Mark

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    Default Re: Always follow the money. Big Pharma and HGH

    Cashing in? "Whopping" 1.4 billion global market for HGH compared to about 45 billion revenue for Roche alone... I wouldn't trust SI for real journalism.

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    Default Re: Always follow the money. Big Pharma and HGH

    Quote Originally Posted by Bobqzz View Post
    Professional cycling is pretty much the dirtiest sport ever- for close to 30 years...
    (cough)
    NFL
    (cough)

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    Default Re: Always follow the money. Big Pharma and HGH

    Off-label use (use of drugs for treatments that are not approved by the FDA) is what the pharmas all want for Christmas. The reps all advocate off-label uses, they are wink-wink-nod-nod "encouraged" to do so by the pharmas, and they even rope in doctors to push the drugs they feel will be the most profitable if off-label use is allowed. There was a recent lower court decision that overturned the conviction of a rep for advocating off-label use under the first amendment. I guess the court felt that reps can say whatever they want as individuals (buy beware?) without being construed as speaking for the company? I not sure how else to explain it. But the long and the short of it is that pharmas desperately want off-label use. Talk about lowered overhead. All they would have to do is get a drug through the FDA for say, curing hangnails and then they could extend the use to just about anything they want without going through any sort of re-approval process at the FDA. HGH is just one of a zillion different drugs they'd like to be able to sell this way without having to worry about getting popped by the law. They are getting it now to some extent, but it can result in large penalties for them, their reps and the doctors who are in on the game. Law firms (like the one where my wife works) make a fair amount of money representing pharmas when they get their hands slapped.

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    Default Re: Always follow the money. Big Pharma and HGH

    Quote Originally Posted by j44ke View Post
    Off-label use (use of drugs for treatments that are not approved by the FDA) is what the pharmas all want for Christmas. The reps all advocate off-label uses, they are wink-wink-nod-nod "encouraged" to do so by the pharmas, and they even rope in doctors to push the drugs they feel will be the most profitable if off-label use is allowed. There was a recent lower court decision that overturned the conviction of a rep for advocating off-label use under the first amendment. I guess the court felt that reps can say whatever they want as individuals (buy beware?) without being construed as speaking for the company? I not sure how else to explain it. But the long and the short of it is that pharmas desperately want off-label use. Talk about lowered overhead. All they would have to do is get a drug through the FDA for say, curing hangnails and then they could extend the use to just about anything they want without going through any sort of re-approval process at the FDA. HGH is just one of a zillion different drugs they'd like to be able to sell this way without having to worry about getting popped by the law. They are getting it now to some extent, but it can result in large penalties for them, their reps and the doctors who are in on the game. Law firms (like the one where my wife works) make a fair amount of money representing pharmas when they get their hands slapped.
    Amen, Brother.

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    Default Re: Always follow the money. Big Pharma and HGH

    Quote Originally Posted by 962 View Post
    Cashing in? "Whopping" 1.4 billion global market for HGH compared to about 45 billion revenue for Roche alone... I wouldn't trust SI for real journalism.
    Not to mention that legitimate uses make up the vast majority of that 1.4B. To insinuate that drug makers are on the take in some vast doping conspiracy is just selectivly ignoring reality.

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    Default Re: Always follow the money. Big Pharma and HGH

    Anyone else gag when talking heads breathlessly extol the "miraculous" recoveries of Adrian Peterson (7mo ACL/MCL recovery back to top level) and Terrel Suggs (6mo torn achillies recovery to top level)?

    Maybe it's because of following cycling, but "miracles" don't happen in biology without pharmacology. It cracks me up either how blind the nfl media is, or how hard they work to make sure they are looking the other way.

    Quote Originally Posted by ElvisMerckx View Post
    (cough)
    NFL
    (cough)

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    Default Re: Always follow the money. Big Pharma and HGH

    Just surprised seeing the andro gel commercials on national tv right now:" now even stronger"!

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    Default Re: Always follow the money. Big Pharma and HGH

    Quote Originally Posted by spopepro View Post
    It cracks me up either how blind the nfl media is, or how hard they work to make sure they are looking the other way.
    The NFL's dirty tentacles reach down through the colleges and into the high schools now. The major TV networks make too much money on it to allow their news journalists to ask questions about the drugs, and unfortunately, there's no social or political will to take on the nation's blood sport.

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    Default Re: Always follow the money. Big Pharma and HGH

    I have really mixed feelings about the whole thing. My HS has had the most successful football program of all time. I didn't play, but I like the coach, had him as a teacher. I really think (desperate to belive?) that they do things the right way. The program has been good for the school, for the band, for the theater (the head coaches' NFL HS coach of the year cash award was donated towards the theatre renovation).

    But everything I know now about "better sport through science" makes me worry. A lot. I desprately hope everything is on the level. For the kids sake.

    Quote Originally Posted by ElvisMerckx View Post
    The NFL's dirty tentacles reach down through the colleges and into the high schools now. The major TV networks make too much money on it to allow their news journalists to ask questions about the drugs, and unfortunately, there's no social or political will to take on the nation's blood sport.

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    Default Re: Always follow the money. Big Pharma and HGH

    Quote Originally Posted by j44ke View Post
    Off-label use (use of drugs for treatments that are not approved by the FDA) is what the pharmas all want for Christmas. The reps all advocate off-label uses, they are wink-wink-nod-nod "encouraged" to do so by the pharmas, and they even rope in doctors to push the drugs they feel will be the most profitable if off-label use is allowed. There was a recent lower court decision that overturned the conviction of a rep for advocating off-label use under the first amendment. I guess the court felt that reps can say whatever they want as individuals (buy beware?) without being construed as speaking for the company? I not sure how else to explain it. But the long and the short of it is that pharmas desperately want off-label use. Talk about lowered overhead. All they would have to do is get a drug through the FDA for say, curing hangnails and then they could extend the use to just about anything they want without going through any sort of re-approval process at the FDA. HGH is just one of a zillion different drugs they'd like to be able to sell this way without having to worry about getting popped by the law. They are getting it now to some extent, but it can result in large penalties for them, their reps and the doctors who are in on the game. Law firms (like the one where my wife works) make a fair amount of money representing pharmas when they get their hands slapped.
    Off label marketing is now protected by the first amendment. In other words, it is legal for Pharma to promote illegal uses of their products according to the 2nd circuit recently.
    So G.D. proud of our Bill of Rights of late..... Ugh.

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    Default Re: Always follow the money. Big Pharma and HGH

    The money that "big pharma" makes on HGH isn't even a drop in a very large bucket compared to the money made off meds you take for life, off and on perhaps - boner pills, statins, antidepressants. The HGH market is a niche market compared to so-called lifestyle drugs.

    The company i worked for, Schering-Plough (now Merck - no, not Merckx, Merck) basically went belly up after Claritin went generic. They set their sights on Vytorin (kind of a statin, but not really) but this wasn't great. The holy grail, of course, is antiobesity - I worked for five years in a whole R&D unit (at the department level of organization) with this goal - hundreds of millions spent (perhaps billions) for not one product to market. That's the kind of risk they're willing to take for a fat pill.

    HGH is nothing in the big picture, profit-wise.

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    Default Re: Always follow the money. Big Pharma and HGH

    cycle racing doping is the minor leagues of doping. there isnt enough $$ in it..

    look to the big $$ sports almost w/o sanction for the "good stuff"

    the nfl is the big show... and they have the head injuries to show for it...
    linebackers now weigh 270+, safeties easily 230...
    crashing into backs running full speed who weigh 230-240..
    shit man, this thing is just starting to show up.

    will be interesting to watch

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