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Thread: tyler hamilton autobiography atmo -

  1. #281
    rabo is offline VSalonistas
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    Default Re: tyler hamilton autobiography atmo -

    No doubt in my mind that LA doped. I just worried that the "burn the house down" approach is going to do much more damage to the sport.
    ps Also don't understand that Steve Tilford on his blog suggested Sky and Wiggins are suspect for spending so much training time on the Canarian Islands. Easy to point fingers.

  2. #282
    Canard is offline VSalonistas
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    Default Re: tyler hamilton autobiography atmo -

    Quote Originally Posted by e-RICHIE View Post
    I will read this book atmo -

    Hamilton To Release Autobiography | Cyclingnews.com

    All kids are nice. This is one kid I knew and who entered the system, was used, chewed up, and spit out.
    Everyone has a choice. He didn't have to enter a system that was already messed up.

  3. #283
    henry g. is offline VSalonistas
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    Default Re: tyler hamilton autobiography atmo -

    Quote Originally Posted by rabo View Post
    No doubt in my mind that LA doped. I just worried that the "burn the house down" approach is going to do much more damage to the sport.
    ps Also don't understand that Steve Tilford on his blog suggested Sky and Wiggins are suspect for spending so much training time on the Canarian Islands. Easy to point fingers.
    More damage to the sport? They have turned cycling into a cesspool where cheating is the price of admission. How do you top that damage? Burning it down would probably be the best solution now as its rotten from roof to foundation.

  4. #284
    Daverino is offline VSalonistas
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    Default Re: tyler hamilton autobiography atmo -

    Quote Originally Posted by Canard View Post
    Everyone has a choice. He didn't have to enter a system that was already messed up.
    Have you read the book?

  5. #285
    VTMike is offline VSalonistas
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    Default Re: tyler hamilton autobiography atmo -

    Just finished it. Page-turner for sure.

    I feel like you don't have to look hard to find people trying to do more than they can to be a part of something that's unrealistic. Whether it's buying more house or car than they can really afford or running ragged to have your kid in the select/regional sports club that feels needed to get him/her to the next level. The stakes are high and being a part of a club keeps inflating to a point that it becomes insane and unhealthy.

    I feel bad for Tyler. Sure, he made a bad decision and had accomplishments and accolades that most of us will never experience. But I agree with those that say that he was a pawn that was chewed up and I wish him the best. .

  6. #286
    henry g. is offline VSalonistas
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    Default Re: tyler hamilton autobiography atmo -

    Quote Originally Posted by VTMike View Post
    Just finished it. Page-turner for sure.

    I feel like you don't have to look hard to find people trying to do more than they can to be a part of something that's unrealistic. Whether it's buying more house or car than they can really afford or running ragged to have your kid in the select/regional sports club that feels needed to get him/her to the next level. The stakes are high and being a part of a club keeps inflating to a point that it becomes insane and unhealthy.

    I feel bad for Tyler. Sure, he made a bad decision and had accomplishments and accolades that most of us will never experience. But I agree with those that say that he was a pawn that was chewed up and I wish him the best. .
    The key is there are always 'experts' and colleagues there to hammer into you that this is the way to go, everyone is doing it, you would be an idiot to miss out, don't be a wuss. Coaches, financial advisors, managers, co-workers, teammates. Humans are herd animals -it's painful and scary to not go along with the group think -what everyone in the tribe is telling you is the way it's got to be for you to belong.

    Before every financial crash there where millions of suckers, I mean investors, convinced they were all going to be millionaires. It's easy to convince someone to engage in an ill advised action and believe in a fantasy if it involves great personal reward.

  7. #287
    classtimesailer's Avatar
    classtimesailer is offline VSalonistas
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    Default Re: tyler hamilton autobiography atmo -

    What did they know? And, When did they know it?
    Pearl Harbor, Watergate, Iran-Contra, 9-11, Iraq,...
    Cycling as a professional spectator sport will survive with barely a hiccup. Festina sold a few books. L.A. Postal will sell a few. The game goes on and on. Never having been a pro racer, I did read this book, and now see pro cycling like pro anything else. And regarding the young athlete and how they were chewed up or mis-led? There are retired pro ball players limping around, looking forward to a future of pain-killers and surgeries and they want their sons to experience the same thrills. These dads know it is effed up and they pull strings to get make their own kids a part of it. Go figure.
    Jeff

  8. #288
    Craven Moorehead's Avatar
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    Default Re: tyler hamilton autobiography atmo -

    It's funny, if you read Millar's lame book you get the sense that dope gave you a little extra push, whereas Tyler's book makes it clear that doping was the difference between getting dropped and just finishing. I really believe Millar is full of shit and likes to pretend his doping didn't make a big difference in his results. I knew doping was (is) effective, but I admit I was surprised by the 'arms race' between teams and doctors, and the degree to which blood doping was able to make or break careers.

  9. #289
    coylifut is offline VSalonistas
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    Default Re: tyler hamilton autobiography atmo -

    Quote Originally Posted by Canard View Post
    Everyone has a choice. He didn't have to enter a system that was already messed up.
    I remember 8 years or so ago sitting in a hotel room at a stage race in the middle of nowhere. i'd suffered a horrible heat bonk the day before and finished 15 up from the bottom. how 15 guys finished behind me I have no idea. i'd somewhat redeemed myself by finishing about 20th in the tt the next morning. me and my 2 roommates were sitting around the room waiting for the evening crit. One of the guys was in the top 10, but suffering projectile diarrhea, the other guy was super duper strong, but had broken collar bones in crits each of the last two years. We were all wasted and knew that we had crit and the 100 mile queen stage the next day. I realized at that moment how vulnerable we three were.

    So, here's Tyler Hamilton, he's 23 years old and the cool guys on his team are receiving little white bags. He's been in europe several weeks where they've raced him in a succession of one week stage races. His hematocrit is tumbling, he's physically and mentally broken and everyone around him is getting stronger. A Spanish Dr. with warm eyes comes into his room hands him a little red pill, tells him it's therapy, not doping and will make it all better. He's in no state to make an intelligent decision, but is forced to do so all the same.

    Yeah, easy choice to make.

  10. #290
    Simonhi is offline VSalonistas
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    Default Re: tyler hamilton autobiography atmo -

    Having read the book I am surprised that what I first thought showed a sign of weakness in an athelete to dope I know feel was in fact the opposite.

    Had I been in a foreign country at a young age, turning myself inside out every day and getting nowhere, barely finishing, given the oppurtunity I would probably have chosen the dark side too.

    I am not proud of that or even justifying it but I understand why they did it to a degree.

    Professional cycle racing is not pretty. It is not a glamourous sport, at least not for 95% of the peleton. The suffering that racers have to endure in both training and racing somehow does not make it seem worth it unless you are aiming for a top spot.

    Given the chance to be in the top 5%, to even see what the glamourous side would be like, I have to admit that I would have taken the chance. It is quite clear that not to dope would be deciding that you would no longer fight for a top position because you would not have the same (cheating / unfair) advantage as that of your peers. How could yo possibly progress to the upper echelons unless you chose to dope in that era ?

    I'm not saying it is right, just saying that for a mid 20's racer with very little life experience I don't think it would be a tough decision to make.

    Props to those that decided not to, but look at how they were treaeted / ostracized.

  11. #291
    Lost in Stockton is offline VSalonistas
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    Default Re: tyler hamilton autobiography atmo -

    Yes, and at this late date probably more embarrassed than scared but basically yes.

    Quote Originally Posted by rabo View Post
    What about USOC that swiped multiple dope positives (including Carl Lewis) under the rug? Full of shit too?
    And before that ,the LA US olympic riders systematically blood doped. Somebody got to be scared about that?

  12. #292
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    Default Re: tyler hamilton autobiography atmo -

    Quote Originally Posted by CyclingNews
    An analysis of blood samples from the 2009 Tour de France, as reflected in Lance Armstrong's biological passport, indicates that Armstrong may have been blood doping during that first comeback year, Michael Ashenden has claimed.

    Ashenden, who previously worked on the UCI's biological passport programme, told California Watch, an investigative journalism group, that “an analysis of blood samples drawn in 2009, contained in an earlier court filing, suggests that Armstrong was recklessly using banned doping methods,” the San Francisco Chronicle reported.

    The passport entries show that the cyclist “produced fewer young blood cells than would be expected, Ashenden said. That suggests his system was adapting to the presence of an extra volume of blood that had been re-infused,” the report said.
    Er ...

    Mom: He was very sickly until he started riding around on that bicycle.


    Dad: Yeah... well... now his body's fine, but his mind is gone.

    -Breaking Away

  13. #293
    -HvA-'s Avatar
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    Default Re: tyler hamilton autobiography atmo -


  14. #294
    henry g. is offline VSalonistas
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    Default Re: tyler hamilton autobiography atmo -

    Quote Originally Posted by shoney View Post
    keep reading
    Wow!!! I'm further along in the book and Armstrong has gone from being a kind of admirable a--hole at the beginning of the book to beginning to look like the Idi Amin of cycling.

  15. #295
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    Default Re: tyler hamilton autobiography atmo -

    Slightly off topic (tyler thread and not LA) but doesn't Armstrong and his lawyers comments in the last week smell of paranoia and desperation on the impending USADA report. Some of Hermans comments almost sound childish and LA is delusional.
    "Even my farts smell like steel!" - Diel

    Sean Doyle

  16. #296
    SteveP is offline vSalon Legend
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    Default Re: tyler hamilton autobiography atmo -

    Quote Originally Posted by devlin View Post
    Slightly off topic (tyler thread and not LA) but doesn't Armstrong and his lawyers comments in the last week smell of paranoia and desperation on the impending USADA report. Some of Hermans comments almost sound childish and LA is delusional.
    its called.." the jig is up"

  17. #297
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    Default Re: tyler hamilton autobiography atmo -

    The jig is up today. News at 11.
    Qui plume a, guerre a. Ce monde est un vaste temple dédié à la discorde.

  18. #298
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    Default Re: tyler hamilton autobiography atmo -

    Quote Originally Posted by Canard View Post
    Everyone has a choice. He didn't have to enter a system that was already messed up.
    Tyler agrees with you.

    I recommend reading the book, dude.
    GO!

  19. #299
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    Default Re: tyler hamilton autobiography atmo -

    Photo from Betsy Andreu's affidavit - 1999 TdF party

    Screen shot 2012-10-10 at 10.58.18 PM.jpg

    1999 Tour party – Peter Meinert‐Nelson, Frankie Andreu, Tyler Hamilton, Pasquel Derme (sp?), George Hincapie, Lance Armstrong, Christian Vande Velde

  20. #300
    kurto is offline VSalonistas
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    Default Re: tyler hamilton autobiography atmo -

    Finally finished the book after having it for a week or so, and I really feel for Tyler. Most of all, though, it reminded what a tough SOB he was, dope or no dope. That Giro with the shoulder and the Tour with the collarbone ...EPO and Test don't mend broken bones. Anyway, the book gives an easy-to-read account of Ty's doping and the systematic approach teams took (take?). Highly recommended.

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