Philosophical frame design questions

[dvancleve]

So what if you wanted to have a custom Max tubed bike built. You can't get a new MX Leader and maybe you'd like to tweak a couple things, but everybody seems to love the way they ride. Perhaps you want a modernized, somewhat lighter version of that bike. Maybe you like a lot of things about a Pegoretti, but aren't into TIG and can't afford one now anyway. Besides, buying a used Pegoretti doesn't support Dario or Gita anyway. Is there anything wrong with having a frame built that is a lot like an MX Leader or Pegoretti but tweaked a little bit?

Doug

[bigbill]

IMHO, if you put a steel fork on a Pegoretti Big Leg Emma, you would have a modern, lighter version of the MX Leader. I have both and they are very similar. The BLE is much lighter, but other than that, I can't tell much difference. Years ago, I had a reynolds ouzo on my MX Leader for a few months. It took almost a pound off the bike but it didn't feel the same. I think part of the mystique of a MX Leader is it's solid balance and that balance requires the Max steel fork.

I am a big guy who turns a lot of wattage. A MXL or BLE will feel different under a lighter guy and he/she may not appreciate it the way that I do. To each their own, that's the beauty of a custom frame.

[WadePatton]

Asking a builder to use your recipe is akin to asking a chef to do the same.

Many offer the customer a choice in tubing, but not all do. Just let 'em know up front what you're interested in and don't be pushy with _how_ you think it should be done. Customer always has some options...but the builder's advice should be respected.

atwo

[sacha white]

Is there anything wrong with having a frame built that is a lot like an MX Leader or Pegoretti but tweaked a little bit?

Doug

No, there's nothing wrong there.

Standing on the shoulders of giants and all that...

-Sacha

[twowheels]

somebody's always pushing the envelope. talk to a builder you respect and get out of the way.

[dvancleve]

Thanks for your replies. Generally I agree with the whole "pick a builder that resonates with you and let them build you a bike" concept, but in this instance I would be looking for a modern (but all steel) interpretation of an MX Leader. It wouldn't really be my recipe, it would be Eddy's :)

Doug

[jerk]

talk to zank-
get a modern lugged bike built out of max tubing. it'll be better than an mx leader ever was, and they were pretty perfect, trust me.

jerk

[rphetteplace]

DeSalvo is doing a max frame for me, Don Walker's doing MAX, Hampsten is doing MAX now, Anvil is a long time MAX proponent, not to mention Zank is taking orders for 10 2010 MAX frames. If you can't find a name in there you don't like I don't know what to tell you.

MAX is the new black.

[hampco]

i've heard a rumor that goodrich is willing to fillet-braze MAX

can neither confirm nor deny but it would be pretty sweet

[justinf]

talk to zank-
get a modern lugged bike built out of max tubing. it'll be better than an mx leader ever was, and they were pretty perfect, trust me.

jerk

I was going to say take a look at those incoming Gaulzettis as well. Not custom, but for the most part neither were the MXs.

[Curt Goodrich]

i've heard a rumor that goodrich is willing to fillet-braze MAX

can neither confirm nor deny but it would be pretty sweet

Nasty rumor but sure if one wants an excessively heavy bike who am I to argue? You're a mean man Hampco. Sorry I'm still feeling Edgey.

[r_mutt]

No, there's nothing wrong there.

Standing on the shoulders of giants and all that...

-Sacha

:thumbs_up::thumbs_up::thumbs_up:

:)

[jerk]

I was going to say take a look at those incoming Gaulzettis as well. Not custom, but for the most part neither were the MXs.

all my bikes are made to order. we make sure the bikes work for the athlete riding them. but yeah- my bikes are the modern rendition of an mx leader style bike. they're certainly a good deal lighter. not steel though.

jerk

[hampco]

Nasty rumor but sure if one wants an excessively heavy bike who am I to argue? You're a mean man Hampco. Sorry I'm still feeling Edgey.

"excessively heavy"?

i come up with 4 pounds, 5 ounces for a TIG'ed MAX frame

versus

four pounds one ounce on my new lugged frame, light tubing

using my toledo grocer's scale

sans paint, both frames 55cm

i can live with the extra four ounces and i'll probably get it back on the lighter steel fork we did for the MAX

neenerneener

[Curt Goodrich]

"excessively heavy"?

i come up with 4 pounds, 5 ounces for a TIG'ed MAX frame

versus

four pounds one ounce on my new lugged frame, light tubing

using my toledo grocer's scale

sans paint, both frames 55cm

i can live with the extra four ounces and i'll probably get it back on the lighter steel fork we did for the MAX

neenerneener

Dude,

4 oz.! That's like a half pound or something like that. What you didn't want to use those lovely max fork blades? Oh sure they're a bizarre shape and limit you to less than elegant fork crowns but at least they're thicker than necessary. But I'm funny that way.

[hampco]

i struggle with MAX forks

i WANT to like them, but...

[dvancleve]

Any pix of the Max frame with lightweight steel fork? I have wondered if a non-Max fork would look scrawny and wimpy on a Max tubed frame. Also, I have seen at least two recent, non-lugged Max frames that seem to have flipped the top tube compared to the way the portly Max lugs went (wide end up front, tall end in back). Why is that?

Doug

"excessively heavy"?

i come up with 4 pounds, 5 ounces for a TIG'ed MAX frame

versus

four pounds one ounce on my new lugged frame, light tubing

using my toledo grocer's scale

sans paint, both frames 55cm

i can live with the extra four ounces and i'll probably get it back on the lighter steel fork we did for the MAX

neenerneener

[Archibald]

i struggle with MAX forks

i WANT to like them, but...

Don't struggle. It only excites them more.

[Eric Estlund]

4 of the tubes in this frame set (fork blades and chain stays) are MAX. I like how they eat tabbed frame ends.

Mix and MAXed for the right combo.

[th_boone]

Pictures were just posted across the hall of a nice lookin' Zank Max frame and fork. (in the image gallery):thumbs_up: