heatsinks

[WadePatton]

another item i don't find consensus on.

waste of fuel or distortion minimization must?

about to carve some outta steel...any thoughts appreciated.

[VertigoCycles]

are you tiggin' or brazin'?

I TIG and I can say for certain that I make a better product by using heatsinks.

[Eric Estlund]

Heat sinks and fillet brazing (brazing in general) doesn't make sense for me.

[Carl S]

another item i don't find consensus on.

waste of fuel or distortion minimization must?

about to carve some outta steel...any thoughts appreciated.

I don't mean this to discount Sean because we're all different but I don't use heat sinks. I have nothing against them but don't find I experience any advantage by using them.

[steve garro]

none here! - Garro.

[WadePatton]

thanks for the input folks.

okay. will re-purpose that metal.

somewhere in my years of collecting information i mustahave gotten some wiring crossed up. that happens once in a while.

still have lots to learn and don't mind learning it. have stays soaking in the kitchen sink--that's cool eh?

[Dave Anderson]

I use 'em.....especially when building fat fillets with LFB on thin tubes.....

[bellman]

I use them, I'm a tigger. I can guarantee you that I do not have the heat control that Carl Strong has and I find that my BB's stay rounder and chase easier, my HT's ream smoother and the seat tube takes about 50% less effort to ream.

A question for Carl, If you are back purging, wouldn't you consider the purge plugs to be a heat sink of sorts?

thanks,
Jake

[Carl S]

A question for Carl, If you are back purging, wouldn't you consider the purge plugs to be a heat sink of sorts?

thanks,
Jake

Not it my case, I only purge stainless and titanium and the purge plugs I use have very little mass. There may be some conductivity but not enough for me to feel.

[anthonymaietta]

I use them, I'm a tigger. I can guarantee you that I do not have the heat control that Carl Strong has and I find that my BB's stay rounder and chase easier, my HT's ream smoother and the seat tube takes about 50% less effort to ream.

A question for Carl, If you are back purging, wouldn't you consider the purge plugs to be a heat sink of sorts?

thanks,
Jake

I agree. I used to really need the heat sinks, but with more experience I move quicker and input less heat to the frame. Since I have them and they only take 15 seconds to install I still use them; also because I do think they result in less wear on my bb tap and seat tube reamer. However, if the were to shit the bed I don't think I would replace them.

[WadePatton]

to clarify, in this particular case: o/a lfb fillets on .9 butts. probably the next few will be built that way.

well then, maybe i'll try 'em a bit and make up my own preferences. my fillets aren't what i'd call fat and my tubes aren't really that thin. i'm far from a master of heat, so there should be some benefits.

i'm such a flim/flam.

[steve garro]

I do use 37mm OD headtubes, to clarify. A little HT deformation is no big deal, IMO {not talking about getting all egg-shaped - my HT facer just skims the rear of the HT post paint facing} the big thing is to have the headset cups in phase with each other. the BB is different - it has to thread nicely. the biggie here is to set back the CS's as far as possible from the shell lip while still maintaining the proper tire/crank/c-ring clearances. i still see people running 68mm shells for 29ers & I wonder why {of course, road bikes are 68mm} but many current issue cranks need a stack of spacers to work with a 68mm shell & i figure go with the wider shell, ditch the spacers, MINIMISE THE DISTORTION, *and* get more/better thread interface - YRMV - Garro.

[abbeyQ]

I use a cheap aluminum seat post as a sink for the seat cluster. I ripped it down the length with a cut off wheel and it's irregular edges make it a wedge like fit. I sleeve my seat tubes and I can get by without one but it sure is nice to not have to get the reamer out for the seat tube. I tig my bikes fwiw. I'd kind of like to make one for the BB and the head tube as well but haven't gotten around to it.

You said you were going to use steel for your heat sink? horrible idea, can't imagine nobody else caught this. Although it would take some effort especially brazing that thing could become one with your frame. Much better to use brass, bronze or aluminum for heat sinks. They conduct heat better than steel and bleed through won't easily melt into them.

[Freddy]

The object of creating the lightest O/S Fillet Builds from the 1960's through the early 70's I used sinks in the head tube then found that I could adjust the miter and never used them again, now with the new LFB Dave and I came up with it is just almost like silver, very little if any bulge through or distortion even on very thin tubes. I wasn't satisfied with only the Fillet Pro as it contains silver and cost more than some builds warrant, I think the re-formulated LFB will be very handy for the majority of builders not working in the super tube realm. This one is capable of SS but is not rock hard, it is very ductile and as easy to file and finish as plain bronze without the alloys in them.
Back to miter modification, most of you already do little tricks to make the miter conforming, but if you want to hear the long story?, call me. The movement during brazing is not visable but doesn't ever stay in conformity even using the 12-6 tacks, each combination of tubes being joined can be adjusted at the miter and diminish the bulge pust through when working in very thin wall joints in diameters common to our use.
I learned one try at a time over many years , but the last Student I had here, got it in minutes. Almost perfect first time results.

Freddy
http://www.fredparr.com

[suhacycles]

The object of creating the lightest O/S Fillet Builds from the 1960's through the early 70's I used sinks in the head tube then found that I could adjust the miter and never used them again, now with the new LFB Dave and I came up with it is just almost like silver, very little if any bulge through or distortion even on very thin tubes. I wasn't satisfied with only the Fillet Pro as it contains silver and cost more than some builds warrant, I think the re-formulated LFB will be very handy for the majority of builders not working in the super tube realm. This one is capable of SS but is not rock hard, it is very ductile and as easy to file and finish as plain bronze without the alloys in them.
Back to miter modification, most of you already do little tricks to make the miter conforming, but if you want to hear the long story?, call me. The movement during brazing is not visable but doesn't ever stay in conformity even using the 12-6 tacks, each combination of tubes being joined can be adjusted at the miter and diminish the bulge pust through when working in very thin wall joints in diameters common to our use.
I learned one try at a time over many years , but the last Student I had here, got it in minutes. Almost perfect first time results.

Freddy
http://www.fredparr.com

Hey Freddy!

Remind me again of some of the specs for that LFB? Working temp range, tensile strength, chocolate versus vanilla flavored, ya know, stuff like that...

I've used 45 silver & Fillet Pro in some lugs and wonder does this stuff flow better or worse?

Thanks!
Hansen

[Freddy]

Removed do to off topic.

[pereiracycles]

I started using heatsinks in my fillet head tubes about a year ago and I love them. The head tube doesn't distort at all with them. I got enough distortion without them that I thought I'd see how much of a difference they made and was very pleased with the difference. It's not huge, but they are easy to use and make the finished product better.

[Freddy]

False hope, while the distortion is arrested the heat band just outside will break down the road.
hope you are working with thick stuff

[bellman]

I started using heatsinks in my fillet head tubes about a year ago and I love them. The head tube doesn't distort at all with them. I got enough distortion without them that I thought I'd see how much of a difference they made and was very pleased with the difference. It's not huge, but they are easy to use and make the finished product better.

Cool Tony,
Since it looks like a split vote, I'd like to see what you guys are using, I've seen the fabrage egg quality ones that Sean is making, I'm using a steel one that I threw together meaning to do a better job later......well, you know how that goes.
This is long enough for most head tubes and it fits the bottom bracket as well. It works smooth enough to snug up and stay in place with just finger pressure on the nut and bolt.

[Freddy]

Lower joint in bottom photo is termintated on camera on the side, those need to be on top